Id request | The Octopus News Magazine Online
  • Thanks for visiting! TONMO is the world's greatest online cephalopod enthusiast community, with interactive content going back to May of 2000, and a biennial conference. If you'd like to join in on the fun, become a TONMO member -- it's easy and free. Follow us on Facebook and Twitter for more cephy goodness.

Id request

avi

Hatchling
Registered
Joined
Nov 20, 2010
Messages
6
#1
Hey, i'm avi from israel and i've found this fossil near afek (North israel)




Can you tell what is it?
Many thanks
avi
 

OB

Colossal Squid
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Oct 19, 2003
Messages
3,086
#2
:welcome: first and foremost! It bears some resemblance to Procheloniceras, but I'm sure Architeuthoceras and Hajar should be chiming in, any minute now!

I have further taken the liberty of moving this to "fossils and history".
 

Hajar

Haliphron Atlanticus
Registered
Joined
Mar 7, 2009
Messages
540
#3
well I had never heard of Procheloniceras before (and don't know much about ammonites), but what strikes me first in the photo are the tubercles and the straight ribs, something like the Late Cretaceous Texanites?
 

OB

Colossal Squid
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Oct 19, 2003
Messages
3,086
#6
I agree on interpreting the tubercules as such, and am trying to make sure I understand the geology sufficiently to make a Texas/Israel linkup via the Tethys overflow. I know Texanites is found as far East as the South of France, but is has four or five rows of tubercules, rather than just two (three?), so, close, yet no cigar. Will keep at it, interesting query to answer :wink:
 

Hajar

Haliphron Atlanticus
Registered
Joined
Mar 7, 2009
Messages
540
#7
Others will know more, but I looked at the Texanites in the "Atlas of Invertebrate Macrofossils" edited by John Murray, where it says, "Ornamented with strong straight ribs with 3 or more tubercles"; "U Cretaceous (Santonian-L.Campanian). Worldwide."
Their illustrated example is from Transkei, Africa.

Your rock is an external mold Avi. I think I can see three tubercles per rib on the inner whorl. Do you have any pieces of the actual ammonite?
 

Architeuthoceras

Architeuthis
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Nov 19, 2002
Messages
2,405
Location
somewhere under the desert sky
#10
Boy I sure missed seeing this thread yesterday, talk about embarrassed :oops:

It looks like Protexanites bourgeoisi, except for that mid lateral node, an ammonite quite common worldwide from the Late Coniacian (Late Cretaceous). The mid lateral node probably puts it in Reginaites or Bevahites. Texanites would have five nodes throughout ontogeny, some of these others develop and lose nodes depending on diameter, these are very hard to ID because of this but it is definitely a Texanitid (probably Santonian).
 

Hajar

Haliphron Atlanticus
Registered
Joined
Mar 7, 2009
Messages
540
#11
Thanks Kevin, a number of new names for me there. Perhaps "Texanitid" is close enough given that we only have a partial external mold to go by and don't confidently know how many nodes there were per rib (since we only glimpse them clearly in the external mold of the inner whorls).

Something that might be fun to try Avi would be to make a latex cast so that you can see what the actual fossil would have looked like.
 

Architeuthoceras

Architeuthis
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Nov 19, 2002
Messages
2,405
Location
somewhere under the desert sky
#12
If there was a mold of the venter it would be a lot easier to ID. The flatness of the side makes me think of Texanites, but at that diameter (compared to the hand) it would surely have at least 4 nodes on the preserved portion, the only one missing would be the outer ventro-lateral node. :smile:

Reading the treatise just now, Anatexanites develops a 4th (lateral) node on later whorls, then it says it is a probable macroconch of Protexanites, so now dimorphism rears it's ugly head. :sly:
 

avi

Hatchling
Registered
Joined
Nov 20, 2010
Messages
6
#13
More of the same
i've found one more fossil today at the same place
But much more small.
The inhaler is for the proportion :heee:
 

Hajar

Haliphron Atlanticus
Registered
Joined
Mar 7, 2009
Messages
540
#15
Well done Avi, there should be more good specimens to find. Is that a clear enough view of the tubercles Kevin to make an ID?
 

palentologistDH

Hatchling
Registered
Joined
Feb 4, 2012
Messages
3
#18
Hello Avi
The fossils you have found is an ammonite. As the first one is only an imprint I can't tell you what species of ammonite it is, however I can tell you the age. Because you can see two layers of spikes in it I can tell you it was Jurassic around 160-180 million years old. These spikes would have been used to tell predictors it was dangerous, it would use these spikes when attacked by shooting them out. The second one is not an imprint but is in bad condition, it is a Liparoceras ammonite, it also has spikes and most are 185 million years old Jurassic.

Daniel
 

Members online

Monty Awards

TONMOCON IV: Terri
TONMOCON V: Jean
TONMOCON VI: Taollan
TONMOCON VII: ekocak

About the Monty Awards