ID request. Please help.

Discussion in 'ID Requests' started by BartK, Jun 1, 2010.

  1. BartK

    BartK Larval Mass Registered

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    Hi,

    Currently I am trying to identify marine life from Cambodia by means of a bunch of images. I am having some difficulties with the cephalopods so was wondering if there would be someone who is able to help me. I have posted the images below. I am not sure if these are suitable or not. Thank anyway. Cheers,
    Bart

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  2. OB

    OB Colossal Squid Staff Member Moderator

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    Well, the squid in 1 and 2 is almost certainly a juvenile Sepioteuthis lessoniana.

    Number 5 suggests Octopus ocellatus/globosus, but I am not sure, for reasons of geographic spread and the smallish suckers on this particular specimen.

    I hope Chrissy could shed some light on the possibility of numbers 3/6/7/8 being juvenile Amphioctopus marginatus.

    4 still has me puzzled, slightly, as it appears a very slender juvenile Octopus cyanea, but I'm missing the blue bits.

    9 Shows a lot of Sepia latimanus aspects.



    Oh, and a big hearty :welcome: as well!
     
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  3. mucktopus

    mucktopus Haliphron Atlanticus Staff Member Moderator

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    Nice images!

    3- Amphioctopus non marginatus (sucker margins are not white) perhaps. cf. kagoshimensis?
    4. Something in Abdopus, as per the body patterning on the arms, and the star pattern around the eye
    5. Something in Amphioctopus
    6. Amphioctopus aegina- gorgeous shot
    7. Same?
    8/ Amphioctopus. Not marginatus. Perhaps something similar to kagoshimensis
    9. Looks like S. latimanus resting
     
  4. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    Not venturing ID (but I think Muctopus pretty well covered that) but wanted to say that if #6 does not make you fall in love with an octopus, nothing will! :smile:
     
  5. BartK

    BartK Larval Mass Registered

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    Thanks a lot for the help. And of course for the welcoming, and compliments. It's amazing to see them hiding or moving around at night. Especially with when their numerous like last time; 8 individuals on appr. 12m2. Before I started working in Cambodia and managing a marine reserve I'd never really seen them around. Only once a Sepiola sp. in the Dutch Grevelingen. Not bad at all!
     
  6. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    BECAREFUL or you will have massive goups of crazy ceph keepers pounding at your door for a job. If I was younger I would lead the brigade :wink:.

    It would be really, really great if you would start(or continue) a jounal on cephs you see and any information you can comfortably provide about managing an underwater wildlife preserve. In addition to Mucktopuses contributions, we have a couple of threads now journaling in situ observations as well as a couple of participating large aquariums (all outside the US but none in Cambodia or Thialand). Dr. Huffard is usually on top of the ID requests (when she is not underwater) so the postings should be mutually beneficial (no tomatos please, Mucktopus :wink:).

    Either Diving and Ceph Encounters or Marine Conservation are good areas to let us watch your work but even continuing this thread would be a win/win!
     
  7. mucktopus

    mucktopus Haliphron Atlanticus Staff Member Moderator

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    I second D's request for a journal on which species you see- especially if you can also record numbers and moon phase (zeroes are also very useful for setting the scale of your observations). You could show some really interesting patterns, and potential for seasonality. It would be great if you could 1) standardize some of your observations- say keeping track of dive time, using a similar search pattern (and not just swimming to the spot where you know an individual already is- as tempting as this is!); 2) measure them (a cutting of a transect tape/knotted string work fine) to measure mantle length (from between the eyes to the back of the mantle) and 3) sex ratio (the third right arm of males is modified, has a groove along the back edge and no suckers on the tip), 4) time/date of sighting, 5) habitat (the latter two helping to assess how much they may overlap/encounter each other/compete for food. and/or shelter).

    This would be similar to the very useful "List of our octopuses" here on Tonmo, spearheaded initially by Nancy. I have found that list extremely useful and have certainly cited it.

    It is up to you if you want to measure and sex them- measuring would require handling, and even with gloves in theory there's still a chance you could get bitten. Amphioctopus is the sister group to blue rings. Based on the fact that they are heavily fished and consumed throughout SE Asia, they are not thought to be deadly like blue rings. But for most species we know nothing of their bite...except A. mototi which is known to have a powerful venom.

    The densities you are seeing are truly remarkable for animals that size. Something very interesting could be going on there, either in terms of mating aggregations or predatory release. You say it's a marine reserve? How intact is the fish community?

    Don't worry D- I've never thrown a tomato here, and don't plan to!
     
  8. OB

    OB Colossal Squid Staff Member Moderator

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    So, Bart, you a fellow Dutchie, by any chance? Glad to see Chrissy and I can at least agree on the genus level :wink:
     
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  9. mucktopus

    mucktopus Haliphron Atlanticus Staff Member Moderator

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    Ob- With Amphioctopus sometimes genus level is about as sure as you can get anyway without sucker counts! Sure you can eliminate some possibilities, but there are plenty of undescribed animals out there too.
     
  10. BartK

    BartK Larval Mass Registered

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    That sounds interesting, however pretty time consuming I guess. I also have never handled an octopus before so I guess it will scare the hell out of me at first :)

    Currently we have not been doing cephs specifically but mainly the entire reef around the 2 islands has been monitored. Because the private Marine Reserve (1,000,000 m2, quite small) has only been established 3 years ago we do keep track of what other animals besides standardized reef indicators are encountered. Such as cephs. Like I'd mentioned earlier having at least 8 individuals on approx 12m2. But also a plenty of squid and cuttlefish eggs. And 3 days ago encountered 2 adult squid during a night snorkel and about 9 juvenile squid. As for habitat, we've only seen them in the sandy bottom areas so far. Most of the data that you mentioned Mucktopus are recorded except point 2 and 3 as these should be done with some care and experience.

    Regarding the fish community, it's recovering. Approximately 10 years ago the whole area was trashed by explosive fishing and trawlers. There was nothing left in the area. Since the inception of the Marine Reserve a lot of species have either recovered or returned, such as seahorse and large barracudas and jacks which you hardly find in non-protected areas. I've done a case study on the effectiveness of this Reserve, and fish communities of grouper, snapper, butterflyfish, and rabbitfish are 3-fold higher than non-protected areas in the same archipelago with similar conditions except for fishing. The Reserve is a 'no-take' reserve.

    @ob; indeed a fellow Dutchie

    ps. I like this short video. Notice the fish encounter between 6 and 7sec. (March 14, 2010; 9:33PM)
    [video]http://www.klush-rakshots.com/samples/SongSaa/MVI_2968_01.mov[/video]
     
  11. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    I would not call that snack an "encounter" but missed it twice (caught it on the third go round though). Thanks for the brief and as much as you can find time to communicate to us! I enjoy coming back to the thread just to look at photo #6 :wink:
     

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