New octo ID. I'm stumped.

Discussion in 'ID Requests' started by hooterhead, Sep 16, 2010.

  1. hooterhead

    hooterhead Pygmy Octopus Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2008
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    0
    So this little guy has me stumped. We got him in from LA a couple of days ago. No idea where he came from. Sorry for the cruddy pics but he's small. That is a critter keeper lid for size comparison. The marks above each eye are the only real feature I can make out. They are a baby blue normally. There are no eyespots that I can see. Any ideas?

    Thanks
    Brandon
     

    Attached Files:

  2. CaptFish

    CaptFish Colossal Squid Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2009
    Messages:
    2,832
    Likes Received:
    96
    Location:
    South Florida
    From those pictures I really cant tell anything. However if it came from Liveaquaria then it is likly and Adopus, usually aculeatus.
     
  3. hooterhead

    hooterhead Pygmy Octopus Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2008
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    0
    Definitely not aculeatus. I've had several of those. Aculeatus don't have these marks above their eyes. I'm a manager at a LFS and it came from a wholesale facility in LA. I normally don't order my octos that way but had reason to this time. It, of course, was labeled as a "common brown". I'll try and get some better shots of it tonight or tomorrow. Seems to be more nocturnal.

    Brandon
     
  4. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2006
    Messages:
    19,083
    Likes Received:
    1,131
    Location:
    Gainesville, GA USA
    Unfortunately, as CaptFish mentions, the photos don't help other than possibly to show a red coloration. I was about to ask if it was noctural because we have only seen two species from LA (that I can remember) and the nocturnal red one has been some form of macropus (Diver's Den has had other though and Maya was hummelincki). Look at Puddles thread and see if it looks similar. You should see green fluorescent dot on it at times and a really striking red when annoyed. I have had two (Puddles is from LA) of this species (but don't know what it is, I believe the dive community lables them luteus but they don't fit Norman's description. I do believe they are quite common in Indonesia) and they are extremely human friendly ... at 3:00 AM.
     
  5. hooterhead

    hooterhead Pygmy Octopus Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2008
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    0
    Don't believe that's it. The marks are always present. I'll get some more pics.
     
  6. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2006
    Messages:
    19,083
    Likes Received:
    1,131
    Location:
    Gainesville, GA USA
    Sorry, I missed the "baby blue marks above the eye". I saw the marks but just assumed camera flash. If those are always there then you have something new for us to find I think. We have noticed that hatchling briareus (this is not briareus) have a blue circle around their eyes that goes away after a few months but it is not a stripe like your mystery animal. Please DO get more photos!

    Can you estimate the mantle to arm ratio?

    Do you have a copy of Norman's Cephalopods, A World Guide? If so, look up Octopus ornatus on page 252. I am probably trying to see this stipe pattern where it is only hinted at in the photos though.

    Oh, and do you ship?
     
  7. hooterhead

    hooterhead Pygmy Octopus Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2008
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    0
    I can definitely ship. Arms are probably 1" now. Mantle is probably 3/4"-1". I'm at home now and it didn't show it's face at all today. I'll get it into a smaller container in the morning and see about some better pics and measurements.
     
  8. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2006
    Messages:
    19,083
    Likes Received:
    1,131
    Location:
    Gainesville, GA USA
    If shipping is not a problem, posting an octo on our availability thread would be welcomed when you have one available. You get brownie points for a photo and extra for an id :grin: We are constantly looking for new suppliers, especially after crab season.

    With arms that short I am guessing it is under 5 months old (going by the arm length on my two briareus hatchlings and my young hummelincki). I would have guessed the octo to have been larger from the photo and still wonder about 1", 1:1 ratio for the arm length. As you can see in my photo, even this very small hummelincki (I think - this species is most peculiar) shows close to an adult mantle to arm ratio of 1:2.5. One of the things we have found useful for reference is to put either a ruler or a coin under a clear container holding the octopus.

    I hope this one is still in the critter keeper when you go back to the shop. Small octos have been known to escape critter keepers very easily. I know of one about half that size that recently escaped very small holes poked in a plastic bottle, never to be seen again. The critter keeper grid will likely pose no barrier, as Animal Mother discovered with Kalypso (fortunately Kalypso escaped into his tank but went unobserved for several weeks).
     
  9. hooterhead

    hooterhead Pygmy Octopus Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2008
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    0
    The octo has been in this keeper for a few days now with no escapes. If it does, it will be in a 29 gallon with a couple of small fish. No big deal to find it in there.

    Here are some more pictures. It's actually quite a bit bigger than what I was thinking. You can see the quarter as a size comparison. Also, I noticed very little "webbing" between arms. My aculeatus had quite a bit of tissue and this one has almost none.

    Brandon
     

    Attached Files:

  10. hooterhead

    hooterhead Pygmy Octopus Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2008
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    0
    More...
     

    Attached Files:

  11. hooterhead

    hooterhead Pygmy Octopus Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2008
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    0
    Also, color does not seem to vary much. Stays that red to black color most of the time.
     
  12. CaptFish

    CaptFish Colossal Squid Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2009
    Messages:
    2,832
    Likes Received:
    96
    Location:
    South Florida
    Wow, Since you posted those photos i have been flipping through my bible, Mark Normans Cephalopods a world guide, and I see nothing with that blue mark over the eye. Super cool.
     
  13. hooterhead

    hooterhead Pygmy Octopus Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2008
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    0
    Perhaps a juvenile coloration then?
     
  14. CaptFish

    CaptFish Colossal Squid Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2009
    Messages:
    2,832
    Likes Received:
    96
    Location:
    South Florida
    Do you have any idea what region of the planet it came from?
     
  15. hooterhead

    hooterhead Pygmy Octopus Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2008
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    0
    No. Called the wholesaler and they said "probably Indo-Pacific" but who knows. It was a salesman. I couldn't get the guy who does the ordering on the phone yet. If I can, maybe he'll know. I'm on the way to the CRAZE conference so it'll be Monday before I can call them again.
     
  16. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2006
    Messages:
    19,083
    Likes Received:
    1,131
    Location:
    Gainesville, GA USA
    Those eye markings are most interesting. Please consider journaling this little guy if you keep him and encourage the buyer to journal him if he is sold.

    It appears that her front two arms are shorter than the others. Is this photo observation correct? She is bigger than my 3 month old briareus shots and I would suspect that the mantle to arm ratio is close to adult proportions (1:2.5 or 1:3?). The adult size, however, is anyone's guess.
     
  17. skywindsurfer

    skywindsurfer Architeuthis Registered

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2009
    Messages:
    1,723
    Likes Received:
    5
    Those pictures look kind of similure to O. Rubescens. Anyone have anything on that?
     
  18. CaptFish

    CaptFish Colossal Squid Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2009
    Messages:
    2,832
    Likes Received:
    96
    Location:
    South Florida
    O.rubescens has a mantle to arm ratio of 1:3, full grown they have a mantle of around 10cm and arms that are 30cm. In addition Hooter said the distributor though it was from indo-pacific. Rub comes from mostly the north east pacific.
     
  19. skywindsurfer

    skywindsurfer Architeuthis Registered

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2009
    Messages:
    1,723
    Likes Received:
    5
    Ya I know about the range of O. Rubescens, but he said "Called the wholesaler and they said "probably Indo-Pacific" but who knows." so I was just pitching in. I wasn't taking into consideration the arm to mantel ration.
     
  20. mucktopus

    mucktopus Haliphron Atlanticus Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2003
    Messages:
    523
    Likes Received:
    51
    Hi all! It looks like Octopus bocki, from the tropical Pacific- it's a pygmy, so almost (if not already) full grown. A very pretty animal- strictly nocturnal though, so unlikely to come out.
     

Share This Page