I'd please don't trust lfs

Discussion in 'ID Requests' started by brent&kitty420, Jun 2, 2012.

  1. brent&kitty420

    brent&kitty420 O. bimaculoides Registered

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    Don't trust LSF to know species of octopus
     

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  2. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    Some how this hobby spurs others, one, out of necessity, being improvement of photo skills :grin: (for some it is a full blow additional expense!). Clearer photos definitely needed but you can look for a few clues. This is particularly important for the possibilities here because any other species we normally see needs to be kept much warmer.

    What to look for to ID a bimaculoides (not to differenciate between the two bimacs, we just don't see bimaculatus):
    1. A pair of Eyespots (ocelli), one below each eye. They will look basically like a bull's eye and can be detected in all but the very darkest of brown coloration. When very clear it will show as a yellow ring, a black ring, a blue ring and a black center but the sharpness and strength of the colors will vary with mood. If there is no sign of an eyespot, slowly bring your temp up to about 75 (it should be below 72 for a bimac and below 68 is better). If you are sure it is not a bimac let it come up to 78.

    O. bimaculoides


    2. IF you find the eyespots (keep in mind the colors can vary so you are looking for the circles in the right place, not the colors) next, look at the tips of the suckers. If they are a strong orange (not peach), the chances are you have a bimac. If they are white, keep watching until you see a definite strong color. If they are purple/blue you have an O. hummelincki.

    O.hummelincki (filosus)


    If you DON'T see an eyespot, it is unlikely a bimac but still could be O. hummelincki as their ocelli are not always visible. Don't look at the other differences in the two similar species. Just use the photos for the topics mentioned. They can both look very much like each other in some of their costumes (I've only kept one bimac but do think there are some looks that are not similar but they share many of the same textures and colors).

    Look at the arms and mantle (the sack behind the eyes, not including the eyes). Using your thumb and pointer finger, try to gauge the ratio between the mantle and the arms (unstretched). Very scientific calculations here :roll:

    Look at the arms, are they fairly uniform for most of the length or do they seem to taper very quickly?

    At the top of the journal and photos subforum, you will see stickies (colored green and always at the top) titled List of Our Octopuses 20xx. If you open any of the years you will find the species (if determined) and the name is a link to the journal. Look at some of the photos of the species represented keeping my suggestions in mind.

    You can look at www.octopusid.com for a few hints and examples. Click on the opening blue screen and scroll on the left until you see Identifying Traits. It is a little difficult to navigate but the pictures may be helpful.
     

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  3. brent&kitty420

    brent&kitty420 O. bimaculoides Registered

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    I found yet another store who has the same species and knows no information on it
     
  4. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    Were you able to observe the eye spots and sucker tips?
     
  5. brent&kitty420

    brent&kitty420 O. bimaculoides Registered

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    Whitish and eyes are relatively high off the mantle
     
  6. brent&kitty420

    brent&kitty420 O. bimaculoides Registered

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    And no apparent eye spots on the body just like Brown and tan stripes then mottled brownish green calm
     
  7. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    Then I am pretty sure you don't have a Pacific animal so keep the temps between 75 and 78. Now try to determine the arm length in terms of mantle:arm ratio. I suspect this is an Indonesian animal, probably in the Abdopus complex but arm length will help promote or demote that thought (however, the most common we see, aculeatus, will have purple/blueish sucker tips most of the time (all can show white so you have to watch for the tips to show color).

    Does it come out in the daytime?
     
  8. brent&kitty420

    brent&kitty420 O. bimaculoides Registered

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    Nope he's nocturnal not really even coming out in the red led lighting either
     
  9. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    I kind of suspected that. Have a look at Espy to see if we are close. His name comes from Octopus SP, meaning an undetermined species. I think he was part of the Abdopus group but was not an aculeatus.

    He spent most of his time inside the Live Rock and I suspect these are caught as LR hitch hikers.
     
  10. brent&kitty420

    brent&kitty420 O. bimaculoides Registered

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    This kinda seems like mine but mine has smoother skin
     
  11. brent&kitty420

    brent&kitty420 O. bimaculoides Registered

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    And arm lengths are about 2-2.5 Times thr length of the mantle. I'm thinking of picking up another tomorrow he seems to be doing great in tropical temps and loves my buffet of live crabs snails and shrimp
     
  12. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    Be very cautious about putting two in the same aquarium if this is your intent. Of the species that have been tried on TONMO, only O. mercatoris has been successful and only if they were raised together or caught together. All other attempts have cost the life of one of the pair.

    There have been more or less successful attempts at keeping O. vulgaris in multiples trying to raise them as food. However, these were very large tanks and some predation occurred. Mote did house a pair successfully but they were found very young and living together in the wild.
     
  13. brent&kitty420

    brent&kitty420 O. bimaculoides Registered

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    I have them in different tanks I know now the second one I just picked up is a male he's acclimating now. Not positive but from what I can see the first may be a female not sure gonna keep them away from eachother for sure though
     
  14. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    The most serious cases of cannibalisim will likely be if a female is involved. If you are consider mating, view the Raising Octopus From Eggs subforum. From the little we have journalled, mating should be a controlled experiment and temporary "togetherness" but not housing them together. Tank size may be an important factor. Either way you decide, please continue to journal. Successful or not, it helps the keeping community.

    Note that these are likely small egg animals and only a very limited number of species and small number of hatchling survival has been achieved (I have read of no cases where the few survivors have succeeded to live a full life span but there have been a few to survive to settlement and into the juvenile state). We keep experimenting though and this is not meant to discourage, just prepare.
     
  15. brent&kitty420

    brent&kitty420 O. bimaculoides Registered

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    Yeah, I am totally aware of what could happen if house together. And with the limited life time is a problem as well but I wish to keep them they are so fascinating I will definitely keep up on progress with both of them. Still can't wait to learn more about this and all octopus
     
  16. brent&kitty420

    brent&kitty420 O. bimaculoides Registered

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    They are definitely liking no light at this point
     
  17. brent&kitty420

    brent&kitty420 O. bimaculoides Registered

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    Lame pic and will get better as soon as I can
     

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  18. brent&kitty420

    brent&kitty420 O. bimaculoides Registered

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    Do you ever get that terrible feeling that something is wrong with one of them ? I almost want to pull the hiding spots out to make sure they are ok but I know I shouldn't so I'm not going to.
     
  19. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    Welcome to new ceph syndrome. You never get over it! The first 2 weeks are the pins and needles time and, even after 20+ octos, I am never comfortable until that period has passed.
     
  20. brent&kitty420

    brent&kitty420 O. bimaculoides Registered

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    My girlfriend hates it she wakes up to find I've disappeared down to the garage smoking a cigarette in the dark trying to catch a glimpse lol
     

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