Dwarf octos

flash02161

Cuttlefish
Registered
#1
I had been doing all my research on Bimacs...however, due to my financial situation, i have decided to start out with a dwarf octo.
I have not been able to find any substantial information on the internet so far for dwarfs.

I was wondering if there is anything that should be done different with dwarfs or things to look out for? Are they any harder to keep? I've heard they dont live as long? and What species of dwarf octo should I look for?
 

GOrmCu

Pygmy Octopus
Registered
#2
according to "Cephalopods a world guide" by Mark Norman

Lets see....

Octopus Bocki, octopus digueti, octopus fitchi, octopus joubini,
octopus micropyrsus, octopus parvus, octopus superciliosus,
octopus warringa, octopus wolfi.

from what i know pygmy octos live very short lives (up to 6 months or so)
and are obtained rather late in their lives. The only one I know to be found at least online is at http://www.aquacon.com/mollusks.htm

They will require very small food as the largest (o. digueti) is 20 cm total
length. Ok, I am out of info for ya sorry. Good luck though. :mrgreen:
 

cthulhu77

Titanites
Supporter
#3
Sad but true...the only dwarf octos I have worked with are O. digueti and Blue Rings (which are not exactly a dwarf, but close)...and yeah, they are almost impossible to find until maturity...and they last about two months or so prior to kicking the bucket....which makes them hard to collect/buy, as you really aren't getting much out of the experience.
Two years ago, a friend and I were yapping about trying to produce digueti in captivity...so far, that is still a pipe dream. Maybe with the newer, larger house it may become a reality...time will tell !
greg
 

flash02161

Cuttlefish
Registered
#4
from what i've read so far on this forum, it seems like dwarfs are not the way to go:they live to short and are lucky to ever see them...However, my lfs owner, the guy i've been running my octo ideas by is extremely knowledgeable about just about everything aquaria....with that in mind and his extensive education and personal experience, I trust his opinions and recomendations very much....he has also kept several octos, and he suggested that i start out with a 12 gallon eclipse system(escape proof) and a dwarf octo before I graduate to a larger more complicated system(keeping in mind that it could later be used to keep a baby bimac until it is larger and better sized for my projected 75gal, or food). Any thoughts on this?
 

cthulhu77

Titanites
Supporter
#5
Well, 12 gallons is awfully small for even a dwarf octopus...remember, they need to be able to swim and travel around like any other animal to have some semblance of normality...I keep digueti in a 29 gallon tank, and that is perhaps a bit too small...
Secondly, the eclipse system really doesn't work all of that well for octopus (and it is certainly not escape proof !)...there really isn't a way to incorporate a skimmer into the system (which is necessary), and the eclipse is unable to cope with the high loads that an octo puts on an enclosed environment...
To be honest, the difference in cost between a setup for a dwarf octo and a bimac is maybe 100-150 bucks at the most...is it really worth saving that much for so much less time with an octo ? If it is, I would recommend setting up at least a 20 gallon tank, with a hang on the back skimmer/filter unit...but it is a lot of cash to spend for a month or two of live octo observation !
greg
 

Black96WS6

GPO
Registered
#6
flash02161 said:
from what i've read so far on this forum, it seems like dwarfs are not the way to go:they live to short and are lucky to ever see them...However, my lfs owner, the guy i've been running my octo ideas by is extremely knowledgeable about just about everything aquaria....with that in mind and his extensive education and personal experience, I trust his opinions and recomendations very much....he has also kept several octos, and he suggested that i start out with a 12 gallon eclipse system(escape proof) and a dwarf octo before I graduate to a larger more complicated system(keeping in mind that it could later be used to keep a baby bimac until it is larger and better sized for my projected 75gal, or food). Any thoughts on this?
The Eclipse system is not escape proof. However the nice thing is, it is completely enclosed, so you'll just need some duct tape and something heavy on top to keep the octo from lifting it. If you're getting a dwarf octo then you won't need anything too heavy on the lid, because he'll be too small to lift it. You'll just have to ensure you cover any potential escape holes!

You will need to test the water regularly to keep an eye on the conditions, and do regular water changes to keep nitrates down. A bio-wheel plus live rock/sand can easily handle the bio-load of a dwarf octo. Or, once you get enough live rock in the tank, the live rock will serve as a biological filter and you can remove the bio-wheel altogether.

You should go to the Nano forum at Reefs.org if you have any more questions on setting up a smaller tank/mini reef:

http://www.reefs.org/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=55&sid=d9952ea879d746742604f2b399a4807f

Here is a pic of my setup, currently in the cycling process. To the left you can see the Berlin 60 skimmer, designed for up to 60 gallon aquariums. I have a 30 gallon, so it's a little overkill. But it really works well, and keeps the water sparkling clear, while at the same time providing lots of oxygenation via the airstone. You should see the difference in color of the water in the collection cup compared to the aquarium! But that just means it's working properly :wink:. And while you can't tell in this photo, there's lots of water movement:

 

Black96WS6

GPO
Registered
#7
Oops!

I almost forgot to mention, when looking at the above pic, that skimmer looks a lot smaller than it really is, I just realized!

It's because the pic is taken at an angle and to the left. For example, look at the rocks on the bottom to the left. Those aren't actually 3 rocks, there's only 2 in the tank. But see what the tank/angle is doing? It's making it look like I have 2 decent-sized rocks and a compressed copy of one on the far left! But it's actually the same rock! The skimmer is longer and about 3 times wider in reality than the size of what it appears in the photo :smile:
 

cthulhu77

Titanites
Supporter
#8
QUOTE:"A bio-wheel plus live rock/sand can easily handle the bio-load of a dwarf octo. Or, once you get enough live rock in the tank, the live rock will serve as a biological filter and you can remove the bio-wheel altogether."

I really must disagree strongly with this bit...the bio wheel can in no way handle the bio load of even the smallest octo...it is meant for freshwater, not salt, and has sooooo many problems with it it really shouldn't even be considered usable.
Trying to use a "natural filter" system in a small tank is ludicrous...sure, it works quite well in a large tank with a small bio load, but in no way, shape, or form is it ok for such a small environment.

Being "cheap" here is not a good way to go...make sure you have the best environment you can provide for your octopus, no matter what size or species...

greg
 

Black96WS6

GPO
Registered
#9
cthulhu77 said:
QUOTE:"A bio-wheel plus live rock/sand can easily handle the bio-load of a dwarf octo. Or, once you get enough live rock in the tank, the live rock will serve as a biological filter and you can remove the bio-wheel altogether."

I really must disagree strongly with this bit...the bio wheel can in no way handle the bio load of even the smallest octo...it is meant for freshwater, not salt, and has sooooo many problems with it it really shouldn't even be considered usable.
Trying to use a "natural filter" system in a small tank is ludicrous...sure, it works quite well in a large tank with a small bio load, but in no way, shape, or form is it ok for such a small environment.

Being "cheap" here is not a good way to go...make sure you have the best environment you can provide for your octopus, no matter what size or species...

greg
Greg, do you have something against people that have success doing things differently than you do?

Please provide your lab tests that show a bio-wheel cannot handle the bio-load of even the smallest octo? That is a ridiculous, incorrect statement.

Would you like me to post pics of my saltwater aquarium when I get home to prove you are incorrect? It contains a snowflake eel, a long-horned cowfish, a juevenile boxfish, a hermit crab, a bumble-bee snail, and a few pieces (not a lot) of live rock...all being run under...GASP! A BIO-WHEEL!! :shock:

I will provide detailed photos of the entire setup, and THEN I will perform a water test, next to my computer screen with CNN up so you can see it was performed today, and you will see...*GASP* 0ppm Ammonia and 0ppm Nitrite!!

Please don't state your opinions as fact, that's where you step over the line. :mad:
 

Black96WS6

GPO
Registered
#10
I'm back, I wanted to add more to this. Here's some additional comments:

1. Q:What is an Eclipse system, anyway?. A:It's basically a Power Filter, Wet/Dry filter, and Power Head built into one unit (the top that covers the aquarium).

2. Q:What is the difference between getting an Eclipse system and setting up all the above items separately? A: There IS no difference!

There is absolutely NO DIFFERENCE from setting up an Octopus tank with a CANNISTER FILTER or an ECLIPSE SYSTEM. Bio-wheels, Bio balls, Bio towers, they're all the same!

In fact, one could argue that an Eclipse system is BETTER than a cannister filter, because:

A) Bioballs and and the like type of filter media in CANNISTER FILTERS tend to trap detritus and you can't see it when this happens.

B) CANNISTER FILTERS are harder to maintain properly. You have to turn them off, open them up, and be careful about the seals in order to service them. Also, IF A SMALL BLOCKAGE OCCURS, YOU WILL NOT KNOW ABOUT IT UNTIL YOU SERVICE THE UNIT.

C) The Bio-wheel is exposed to much more oxygen and constant wet/dry states compared to a CANNISTER FILTER's bio-tubes/balls/etc, which are always submerged inside the cannister.

An Eclipse system is not optimal for growing corals and true mini reef tanks, because the LIGHTING is not strong enough for growing corals, not because it can't handle the load!

For a FISH ONLY W/ LIVE ROCK tank, or an OCTOPUS W/LIVE ROCK tank, an Eclipse system will work fine as long as you include a protein skimmer in that equation.

Again, I'm talking about BIOLOGICAL FILTRATION when speaking of the bio-wheel and live rock in the previous posts above, NOT CHEMICAL/MECHANICAL which is provided by the carbon and pre-filter pad in both the cannister and Eclipse systems.

Obviously if you had a tank with just live rock and no other filtration method, especially in such a small system, the tank inhabitants would quickly succumb!
 

Black96WS6

GPO
Registered
#13
Bye all

I think this will be my last post here, I don't plan on returning.

I came here originally via another poster's recommendation in another forum to find out the latest information on Octos, having been away from them the past 15 years.

Instead, I found everyone here is no further along than I was 15 years ago in my old tanks when I was using Eheim cannister filters and straight sea water. And some members are so bent on impressing their own concepts and ideas of how to do something or how things should work it presents a negative atmosphere and suppression of ideas, especially when new people are just asking basic questions.

"Oh no, you can't do it that way! That will never work!"...despite the fact that people have been doing it successfully just fine, including myself!

There is one good thing from my short time here, I learned that OctoPets is a 30 minute drive from my house and the source of aquacultured bimacs, so that's good.

Bye all! :smile:
 

cthulhu77

Titanites
Supporter
#14
Good call on the 75 gallon...that is a fantastic size of tank, and very easy to maintain !!!
Point b: you are going to be waaaaaaaay happier with a bimac !!! be sure to post your tank in the database, and keep all of us bimac enthusiasts up to date as things progress...I am jealous...we are moving this summer, so all the salt tanks have to shut down...it will be another year for me !!!
greg
 

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