[Octopus]: Spider and Cletus - 2 new octos aculeatus mabie??

Discussion in 'Cephalopod Journals' started by gpx1200, Oct 19, 2012.

  1. gpx1200

    gpx1200 GPO Registered

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    made a 7hr drive yesterday to pick up my first octo in person from ny aquitcs but i couldn't decide on one so i got 2. one is very small with a mantle the size of a marble and the other the size of a grape, bolth came from the same distributor as well as the other 2 they had in stock wich all looked to be the same species. they wer still in the bag from arival that morning. bolth of them ate 2 gohst shrimp last night during aclimation and in the tank, the small one took live shrimp right from the tongs on the first and second try, the larger one is more cautous and didn't take the shrimp untill i released it and moved away. i'm going to get some grass shrimp and hopfuly some small fidlers tomorow they also have plenty of snails and hermits in their to snack on
    i can't seem to get good pics of the small one( i know they need names) but heres a few of the big guy
    anyone care to vairify or corect my id.
     

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  2. gpx1200

    gpx1200 GPO Registered

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    a few more of the big guy, the spot in the rocks is wear he has been since last night, it's funy becouse the last resident of this tank was a mantis shrimp that went straight to that same spot and stayed their for two days when i first put her in the tank.
     

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  3. gpx1200

    gpx1200 GPO Registered

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    the only shots i could get of the little one, first in the bag flashing what i would guess would be angry colors and then in the tank trying to look like a mushroom, the hole behind that mushroom has been his home for most of today.
     

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  4. CaptFish

    CaptFish Colossal Squid Staff Member Moderator

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    Cool! but I don't think these are aculeatus. Arm length is too short and the colors are different. they do have a star pattern around the eye, but several species have that.
     
  5. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    Humm, Picture #2 on post #2 looks familiar and NOT Abdopus complex. I am jealous if it is what my first impression suggests but I hope you have a couple of big tanks! Maybe they will be small like LittleBit. I could be wrong but I agree with CaptFish that that one does not look like any of the Indonesian animals we see.

    I've had two Atlantic's in the last two years that were way smaller than standard size. I waffled away from my initial call on both of them because of the slow growth rate and sizing but in both cases (LittleBit and Yeti) I returned to my original call and decided they were just small. It will be interesting to see how these two grow.
     
  6. gpx1200

    gpx1200 GPO Registered

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    ok your scareing me a little, what do you mean by "big tanks" the larger one is in a 72 bowfront now and the small one is only in my 45 hex mangrove tank for now but he's tiny, i also have a 92 corner up and runing that will become home for one of them in the future, do i need to plan for bigger than that?
     
  7. Tentacle Toast

    Tentacle Toast GPO Supporter Registered

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    Good call on making the drive to pick them up yourself; I'm in the Buffalo (NY) suburbs, & am probably going to make about that drive myself...& most likely to NY Aquatics, as I think they're the closest reputable ceph sellers to me. How was your dealings with them?
     
  8. Tentacle Toast

    Tentacle Toast GPO Supporter Registered

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    ...How did you transport them? Did you leave them in the same bag they arrived at the shop in, or did you devise some type of travel ser up?
     
  9. gpx1200

    gpx1200 GPO Registered

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    they arived that morning and wer still floating in the bag they wer shiped in, this was prearanged so they did not have to be aclimated twice in the same day, i was going to bring a cooler to keep them in but i forgot it on the counter with my camera at home.
    they wer good to deal with, i told them they would probably sell more octos if they posted decent pics so peapole could see what they are geting but they don't even have a camera in the shop. they still had 2 octos left when i left but i didn't see them listed on the site, mabie theyr going to take pics of them to relist.
     
  10. gpx1200

    gpx1200 GPO Registered

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    soo.. what is your first impresion?? the seller insists that these are indo or "bali" species
     
  11. mucktopus

    mucktopus Haliphron Atlanticus Staff Member Moderator

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    I'd still guess something within Abdopus. Sometimes at rest the arms fairly pretty short (2-3x mantle length) and the body color patterns are definitely within range.
     
  12. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    I hope you are right Mucktopus (sort of, LittleBit was a big favorite). The only picture that left a strong impression was #2 bottom and the eyes in that look very vulgaris. GPX, I am probably just seeing things but I will tell you that suppliers rarely know where the animals are collected and it would not be the first time an Indonesian turned out to be something else entirely.
     
  13. gpx1200

    gpx1200 GPO Registered

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    so if they do turn out to be vulgaris will the 72 and 92 be big enuf to house them?
    so far they have been visable on the rocks most of the day and nowear to be found at night the little one sems to prefer the suny side of the tank in the morning.they bolth took a gohst shrimp from the tongs this morning. i'm gutloading some grass shrimp with phyto and oyster feast in a bucket right now and i'm going to offer them each another shrimp tonite and add some to the tanks for them to chase, mabie ill try hand feeding them without the tongs
    the little one has been jumping from barnicle to barnicle today
     

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  14. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    I would say, no way except LittleBit was fine in a 65+ so the answer is not known because you don't know how large they will get. Hopefully my guess is off base as you are well equipped for most any other species. We expected to have to convert the 145 for LittleBit but she only grew to O. briareus size.

    I will also warn you that any behavior (especially "friendly" but time of activity as well) you observe over the next 2 weeks will not likely be what follows. It takes them about that long to really acclimate to the tank and at least a month to properly claim their dens (you will know this is the case when they show their arms when you clean near their den). I mention this not to dissuade you from hand feeding but so that you will not be disappointed when they become reclusive for awhile. Typically, once they are fully acclimated they will start slowly to trust you and expect daily food service. Feeding at specific (within an hour) times daily is the best suggestion I have to promote "trust".

    Your latest picture does not change my opinion on species possibilities :roll:
     
  15. gpx1200

    gpx1200 GPO Registered

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    my larger octo was dancing around the glass tonite for about an hour then i looked away for a second and he's gone, it almost seems like he doesn't want me to see wear he go's.
    after geting a good look for a while i think this ones a male, a few pics show the third arm being smaller than the rest and it was often curled when he was at rest on the glass
     

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  16. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    Have a look at these pictures. You are trying to determine if the octos could be the same (I am thinking this is about the same sizing but neither pictures have reference points). Aculeatus will be much less robust, particularly comparing arms to mantle girth.

    Glass dancing during the day is typical of Aculeatus adults but not a telling factor as other species will do this as well. Additionally, it takes a good two weeks for them to initially acclimate and then maybe 2 months to defend a den so I never expect behaviors I first see to be continued.
     
  17. gpx1200

    gpx1200 GPO Registered

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    ive gone threw that thread several times back and forth compairing littlebit to my larger octo( now named cletus) and i don't think they are the same species, littlebit has a rounder mantle and eyes wear cletus seems to have longer more cylindrical eye stalks and his mantle seems more elongated and football shaped most of the time. i have never seen cletus display the redish color that littlebit comonly wears in the pics, his most comon color is the brown/white mottled color in the last pic i posted ushualy along with a white skunk stripe up one side of his face though i have seen many other color patterns from him and a very cool passing cloud display once for about a minuet. i believ the pic you referd to in post #2 was taken just minets after i released him in the tank and i have not seen that color pattern since then.
    my smaller octo(now named spider) has prety much the same color displays except he/she often has a spikey texture and often flashes a dark/white almost polkadot pattern when i get up close to the tank.
    i also noticed that littlebits arms seem to be more defined and allmost muscular wear cletuses are just kind of round and smooth.
     
  18. gpx1200

    gpx1200 GPO Registered

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    nobody here but us plants
     

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  19. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    The differences you noted would be the ones to look for as diagnostic so I think your tank sizing is safe :grin:. The eyes more than the color pattern is what got my attention in the one photo. Vulgaris has, as you noted more of a lump than a stalk and is quite robust in the arms. Even being a very small vulgaris, she was the strongest octo we have ever kept and played very rough. She did want to play so she was not trying to get rid of us but she was extremely strong for her size.
     
  20. gpx1200

    gpx1200 GPO Registered

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    i just had a prety cool interaction with spider wich i think started with a defensive display in front of his den wich is right near the front of the tank, when ever i see him siting out in the open i go over and put my hand on the glass to try and get a responce, this time he poked out a litle at a time untill his entire body was exposed then faned out as big as posible and flashed a few light dark patterns and jumped from the rocks to the glass wear my hand was and sat their for a few moments then moved back to the rocks. after that i threw him a fidler crab wich he eagerly pounced on and returned to his den (the hole behind the blue mushrooms pictured in post #3), this was our first interaction that was not either feeding from tongs or just runing away from me. he is a ravenous eater and is growing fast ,i'm going to have to move him to a bigger tank sooner than i thought
    i have also seen a change in behaviour in cletus my larger octo but with him it's the oposite he has become more reclusive and runs to hide whenever i open the tank to try and feed him and only seems to want to feed when i'm not looking he still comes out and roams the glass at various times of the day and night but has never aproached me like spider did today.
     

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