Rescued an octopus from an Asian Food Market today

[davelin315]

Stopped into an Asian Food Market today and was saddened to see a bunch of octopuses in a tank, all dead with the exception of this one and possibly another one, but this one was moving around and looking very sad to be in there... it's different than buying a "don't encourage them" type of thing from a local fish store, as this is a food source and they're going to bring them in regardless... anyway, I couldn't help myself. It's currently in a 10 gallon tank as that's the best I could throw together with cold water and an ice probe to keep it cool until I figure out what it is (tank is woefully small for it, it's arms stretch across the tank and can curl up the wall while it's in the corner). My guess is that it's from the West Coast as it was in with abalone and I think that they are collected in California waters, but no idea. Here are some pictures that I sent to the National Zoo to get an ID from a friend there in the Invert House. The ones where it's just sitting there are from when the lights were on, the ones where it's stretched out are from when it was dark and I turned on the lights.

 

[davelin315]

Believe me, I looked for smaller alternatives! The only reason I have this one in the first place is it was donated to school and then the principal told me to take it and sell it or give it away as I didn't see myself setting it up in school due to size... it had been sitting in my room since last school year! So, I traded it away for some frags for school and then the guy who was going to use it as a sump couldn't get it under his stand so when I asked, he gave it back!

Got one out of the sump by placing a piece of PVC in there and leaving it. The other has now moved into the spot occupied by the first one in the sump. Tomorrow I'll put the 90 on a stand and get some water in there and sand and rock and get it started so I can add the octopuses in there later. I'll have to see if they will go together or not.

 

[DWhatley]

No chance that the water is warmer in the sump area is there? ... Just askin'

I actually think the 90 might be right sized for these guys (or at least not too big).

 

[davelin315]

It is a bit warmer where the return pump is, but that's the furthest place from where they are. They didn't seem to want to be in that compartment at all, and the preferred compartment seemed to be the overflow area. We'll see what they do tomorrow. Don't have strainers for the overflows so will have to make one with the elbows on the system and also figure out my plumbing. I just hope I see these guys again once I put them in there! Oh, I'm thinking that I have 2 females right now as I took a long look at the larger of the 2 and didn't see a ligula and also haven't seen one on the other.

Perhaps this will turn into the same thing as getting trios of angelfish that aren't supposed to work... my male unknown with his harem! Will have to see where all of this leads me!

 

[DWhatley]

I don't know anything about the common angels but the pygmies change sex (female becoming male) if there are only females (opposite of the clowns) so that there is a proper harem but that doesn't happen (that we know of) with octos. I did just recently read about one octo that sheds his third arm when he is ready to mate to grow the hectocotylized arm only at that time, thus not having to keep it protected until he is ready to use it.

I have only kept multiples with mercatoris dwarfs and have successfully kept two sets of two males (one group included a female) but never two females. I also saw (and likely already mentioned) two vulgaris successfully house in a Florida aquarium but they were found together in the wild (I believe they were both the same sex and I think they were female but would not put money on it). You are pioneering new ground in several ways

 

[DWhatley]

Jean just posted a photo of the Pinnoctopus cordiformis that is resident in the Portobello Aquarium. It is the same or cousin species to the one at the top of the page. You can't see a lot of Fidgety Fred but notice the eyes in both pictures and the white spots on Jean's shot. The white spots and likely the white eye iris would be diagnostic to the species and it was the eye picture in your first photos that made me go looking for the older Korean photos (very different).

Edit:

One more Pinnoctopus: http://www.tonmo.com/forums/showthr...ucid*-ID-For-NZ-Octopus&highlight=pinnoctopus

And one more of its Aussie cousin: Redirect Notice

I still think these are less likely candidates though

 

[davelin315]

They do look very similar to that one. The picture on facebook really is close - from the coloration I'm seeing at times to the mantle texture to the eye.

On another note, I moved them tonight and I am hoping that it doesn't kill them. After biting holes in the bags I was floating them in to try and slowly temperture acclimate them (the tank was at 72 versus the 57 they were at outside and I slowly allowed the room to become warmer tonight) I decided to open the bags and float them. Of course, the second I did that they crawled right out and shocked themselves. One was in dire shape after crawling out and seemed to not be able to control herself at all (I'm going with them being females as of now as I still cannot find the ligula, although the one definitely is missing an arm - will have to try and figure out which arm that is and see if it's the one that that ligula should be on) but then they saw each other and started to move around and be normal. They both also had the corkscrew arms that were in the video you posted, but as they got over the shock those disappeared and they began to look normal again. One thing about this move, though, I don't think they'll be able to stay together. They showed some aggression towards each other tonight which I guess is also a good sign of health if they can muster the strength to face off. Of course, if this is successful, that will mean I'll need to find another tank to house one of them... my wife is going to kill me!

I'll try and post some pictures tomorrow as the tank is somewhat cloudy due to the flow and the sand I put in there - about a 2" bed with essentially a pile of rock in the middle since I couldn't see when I added it. Hopefully they make it through the night!

 

[davelin315]

Sucks... lost one already. I thought it had recovered but it's the one that didn't dart for cover and it crawled into a corner and was essentially dead. The arms were still responsive and there were some minor color changes but it wasn't breathing despite some minor movement in the mantle. I decided to search for the other body fearing the worst and the other one grabbed my arm and then darted across the tank, so I'm hopeful that this one didn't shock itself to death and it'll be alive in the morning.

 

[davelin315]

The other one is alive still this morning and looks good. That said, it seems to not want to eat shrimp. It grabs it, brings it to its mouth, and then decides it doesn't like the taste... I'll have to get something else to feed it. Wish I had some bait shops in the area that sold crayfish or shrimp!

 

[DWhatley]

You might try again tonight with the shrimp or again a different times. Eating patterns vary a lot with the ones we commonly keep. Age and species have a lot to do with how much and what they will eat but individual animals vary as well. Fiddler crabs (even though not naturally available for many) seem to be the most universally identified and accepted food. Does your asian market have any live crustaceans?

 

[davelin315]

Not looking good tonight. I think that the temperature is too warm for it, despite being in what is considered to be the acceptable range for what I think it is. I threw a chiller on the tank tonight and am going to bring it back down closer to 60 if the chiller can get it that low and see what happens. I am once again not optimistic as the arms are displaying the corkscrew pattern and it continues to reject all food including nassarius snails, a mussel, shrimp, and small live crabs (red claw is what they are called and they are sold along with the fiddlers). If this is a failure I may try one more time, but I'll have to figure out what is optimal for these guys. This is really difficult to do watching them fade like that.

 

[DWhatley]

Unfortunately the temperature shock is most likely to be the cause (cork screwing arms are not a good sign for sure, in KaySoh's case, she is post brood and it is surprising she is still with me) of demise. It is typical to acclimate them for 3 hours just to slowly adjust parameters that are close and more than 2 degrees water temp difference is considered too much margin. The only octo I have ever lost in shipping was a known warm water species that traveled through a blizzard (odd ball routing by the carrier and not warranted or anticipated when it shipped). It arrived on time and alive but in grey color and frigid water. It died later that day even after a very long effort to slowly get the water adjusted. If you try again (and this group came so close that I really hope you do as what you learn may allow more of us to try this, you have a lot of viewers vicariously particpating), I would still consider bringing the temp up to the low 70's but once you acclimate to the lower safe range slowly advance the temperature over a period of 24 to even 48 hours.

TONMO members have had several escapes during acclimation, most have not gone well (but most fatalities were not into the tank). One of my favorites exited a carelessly open tank. I found him before he died but the exposure killed him with in two days (still a mental anguish).

 

[davelin315]

Seems to be doing slightly better this morning, temperature is down to 60 degrees. This is probably too extreme to have all these swings, but it looked like it was really suffering last night so I opted for the drastic change (it dropped about a degree every 15-20 minutes with the chiller). I set the chiller to 58 this morning so that it stays cooler. One thing I did notice is that it seems to have pinched off an arm by itself, either that or the one that died was battling with it and bit off that arm. Hoping for the best still. Not sure that I will actually switch the temperature back up, but may do a degree per day to see how it reacts if I can get it to eat again.

 

[CaptFish]

I have to apologize to both you and your poor octopus. After further research i have discovered the water temps in Korea are in the 60s. I called my brother and asked why he told me it was warm and he said "it looked warm" Anyway i think 60 where you have it is probably perfect.

 

[davelin315]

No apologies needed, it's also seasonal I think and the water temps go up and down with the season. I'm still not even sure that this octopus is from there at all. My learning curve is pretty severe and for the octopus even more severe, the dialogue and discussion here helps tremendously with garnering any information at all.

 

[davelin315]

I doubt very much that this octopus is going to make it through the rest of the night. It is fairly unresponsive and it seems to be attacking its own arms as the others did when they were dying. It still has responsive coloration and when it musters energy to move, it looks normal, but it expends its energy very quickly and there is very ample evidence that it has lost its ability to maintain balance. I am speculating that since the arms can act almost independently of the rest of the octopus that the nerve connections have been damaged and the octopus as a whole is declining due to nerve damage.

That said, I am getting more and more determined to make this work. I am going to try it one more time if this one does not survive through tomorrow and purchase another one as they arrive tomorrow. I am hopeful that this works out as I now am prepared - I've got a tank set up where it can be comfortable, some food for it in the form of live mussels and a couple of small red claw crabs that seem to be surviving in the colder saltwater, and experience through trial and error for how to care for them. I am not going to try buying 2 again as I don't know what I'd do with a second one if it survived given the fact that these last two began showing aggression towards the end, and I am debating whether I'll go for the smallest one I can find or the largest one I can find. I will also probably bring a bag of fresh water for it in case it inks on the way home. If this one somehow manages to pull through then hopefully that means that it has turned some sort of corner, but except for good coloration and pigment responsiveness, this one is displaying all of the bad signs that the previous ones did.