Octopuses share 'living ancestor'

Discussion in 'Physiology and Biology' started by WhiteKiboko, Nov 9, 2008.

  1. WhiteKiboko

    WhiteKiboko Colossal Squid Supporter Registered

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  2. monty

    monty Colossal Squid Staff Member Supporter

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    I moved this over to the biology department, in the hopes of getting Steve's & Kat's perspective on what this means taxonomically, and on what this species' characteristics are that might tell us something about deep-sea octopuses in general. Bonus points for tying in vampytoteuthis, which clearly split from other octos much earlier.
     
  3. Taollan

    Taollan Vampyroteuthis Supporter

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    I would really like to see what will be published. This is so vague as to not really mean much. Octopuses as is the superorder Octobrachia?, Order Octopoda?, Family Octopodidae? These all would have very different implications. Also octopuses dispersing 30 million years ago? That is VERY recently. That, as well as them implying that Megaleledone is basal, makes me think that they are implying Octopodidae family level (which would mean that the cirate octopods, like Grimpoteuthis or Cirrothauma and many other deep-sea pelagic octos, aren't included in this, and Vampyroteuthis would be very far outside the scope).

    Anyhow, annoying evolution misconception of the day:
    "The species could all be traced back to a shallow-water octopus called Megaleledone setebos, which is only found in the Southern Ocean." :banghead:
     
  4. Taollan

    Taollan Vampyroteuthis Supporter

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    Though in all fairness that relatively minor gaffe is nothing in comparison with:
    "According to evolutionary theory it takes millions of years to form opals."
    -John Pendleton

    ...I don't know if I should :lol: or :cry:
     
  5. chrono_war01

    chrono_war01 Colossal Squid Supporter

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    I usually just smirk and nod dumbly when things like these happen, those interested will dig deeper to find more and eventually, end up here....
     
  6. monty

    monty Colossal Squid Staff Member Supporter

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    I'm hoping we can reverse engineer what they actually mean... obviously, the antarctic species didn't stop evolving for 30 million years, so I assume they're saying that it has some traits that there is reason to believe are ancestral to some group of living octos, maybe because a lot of octos needed these traits to survive last ice age, and then radiated when things warmed up a bit.

    I'm not sure if they're saying that Megaleledone is a separate clade from the rest of the Octopodidae that there is some reason to believe is closer to the last common ancestor than the radiated other members of Octopodidae, or something like that.

    This reference has some more info: http://articles.top501.nu/2008/11/11/top501-octopuses-antarctic-ancestor-marine-census/

    including

    More details on this link will be revealed in the November 11th issue of Cladistics.

    I don't appear to have online access to Cladistics... anyone up for tracking down the PDF?
     
  7. monty

    monty Colossal Squid Staff Member Supporter

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    Here's a link to the abstract: http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/121509537/abstract

    Surely, someone must have institutional access.

    edit: OK, through sleeper agents, I have got my mitts on a copy of the paper. Further details after I read it, but it looks like this is only about a clade covering Pareledone, Thaumeledone, Megaleledone, Graneledone, and Velodona.



     

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  8. monty

    monty Colossal Squid Staff Member Supporter

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    p.s. is plain old Eledone no longer a valid genus or something? Given its likely proximity to these others, it seems weird to have not included and example of Eledone.
     
  9. Steve O'Shea

    Steve O'Shea Colossal Squid Supporter

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    There are a number of VERY odd things with the placement of genera in that family (including genera in different families nested in amongst the octopodids).

    Don't lose any sleep about it. I just look at it and go "Oh, that makes no sense what so ever." Moving on.

    Type species of genera must be used before any nomenclatural changes are proposed or effected.
     

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