octopus ID and info please

Discussion in 'The Octopus' Den' started by mreef, Nov 5, 2011.

  1. mreef

    mreef Larval Mass Registered

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    Hi,
    I receive an octopus, and would like to know if you can tell me which species it is?
    here's a video : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8jJr-m8fc6s



    also, maybe you could tell me if it's a he or a she
    and all information like adult size, best food to give, etc

    that would be greatly appreciate

    thank you for your help

    Marie
     
  2. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    Do you know its origination (body of water)? Is it nocturnal? A quick guess from the shorter, thinner back arms and long front arms would be an Indonesian nocturnal animal in the macropus complex like Puddles
     
  3. skywindsurfer

    skywindsurfer Architeuthis Registered

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    It's hard to tell, but I would guess female.
     
  4. mreef

    mreef Larval Mass Registered

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    I supplier told me "she" came from Philippines

    why do you think it's a "she"

    and by knowing that "she" come from Philippines, can you determine the species?
    what would be important to know about her?

    right now we are feeding her small pieces of shrimp, and silver side, 'she' love both
    but she is more active in the morning or when the light is not as strong

    thank you very much for your help!!
     
  5. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    mreef,
    The Philippines would fit for the little macropus but neither of mine were out after full light and both were most active around 3:00 AM. The word Puddles in the above post is a link to his journal and photos. Look for white spots when she is aggitated and green fluorescence that will sometimes show as small spots on the mantle and sometimes are quite bold as in the link to Beldar's journal. To determine sex, observe the third right arm (clockwise from the eyes). If the tip is curled most of the time, that would be an indication of male.
     
  6. skywindsurfer

    skywindsurfer Architeuthis Registered

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  7. mreef

    mreef Larval Mass Registered

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    she really look like "puddle"
    but she seem to be a lot more interactive in the day, she always play around on the morning when the light is on, and will do it a couples of time during the day too

    but when she is tired she will do like 'puddle' and be a puddle lol, when she does that she will become almost all white/gray, if I come close she will become reddish

    I tried to find information on her species, but I didn't find anything
    she look to be about the same size as Puddle, and by reading the post, this would be her adult size... hope she is not too old

    how big should her aquarium be?
    and since they are so intelligent, should I put something in her tank to make life more interesting than just live rock?

    at what temperature should I keep her tank?

    and I know male and female die shortly after reproduction... but if they are no reproduction, how long can she live? (if she is a young adult)

    I'll try to look at her closely to see if I see spot on her this morning... to confirm if she is like Puddle

    thank you again for your help :)
     
  8. Thales

    Thales Colossal Squid Staff Member Moderator

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  9. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    mreef,
    It was my fear that if I had the species right, she is adult, partially from size and partially because she is out during the day. The daylight activity can be discounted somewhat to acclimation (full acclimation usually takes about 2 weeks IME). At the time I kept Beldar, we had two others among members and both would appear during the day from time to time (Lennon has a journal here but Thales only made comments on Zod in Bel's journal)

    To find more photos on this apparent species, Google Octopus luteus and look for diver sightings. Using Norman's Cephalopods A World Guide this is not a correct call on the species but seems to be the tag divers use when they find it (we see this a lot for certain species). There are quite a few animals in the macropus complex and many are simply marked "sp" (for species not identified). Thales and I have both found one in this book that is closer in size and looks but it is marked sp 10.

    I believe all the macropus complex animals (there are even some in Mexico) are warm water animals fo nothing below 72 with 75-78 likely being best and for water quality nothing above 80.

    If she is female, you will likely see her brood soon. Here is the part of Bel's journal when she started to brood. If you read backwards you will see that I thought she was male for quite sometime as I would see her arm curled a little when she was younger. It also took awhile for Puddles to mature but at the size of your new one, I expect she is sexually mature (different species mature sexually at different rates).

    Females will brood. It does not matter if they have mated. If they have not, the eggs will be infertile (as appears to have been the case with Bel). At the assumed age of this one, and the assumed abundance, she will likely have mated but we have not seen hatchlings from this species that I recall. Sadly, it is a small egg species and trying to keep any small egg alive through the palegic period (palegic for about a month) has not been achieved in home aquariums and very little success in large flow through systems in labs or public ones. Bel's journal will give you an idea on what to expect. I recently read that removing the eggs within 24 hours of being laid may prolong life a little and stop the brood behavior (den isolation and cessation of eating) but have not had the opportunity to experiement.
     
  10. mreef

    mreef Larval Mass Registered

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    I didn't know that if there were no reproduction that the female would still lay eggs :(

    well today, my Little Miss Puddle didn't come out to play like she did the past 2 days... she was sleeping under the rock, and when I try to make her come out, she just move an arm like she was saying " leave me alone, don't you see I'm sleeping!!"

    so I don't know if she just start her normal way of being active only at night or if she will brood soon...
    she didn't eat today... so I put a little crab with her... maybe tonight she'll catch it

    .... I don't want her to brood.... I want her to stay alive longer!!
     
  11. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    I am always sad when I have a female because I know the time will be shorter. The live almost as long (my males have out lived my females but supposedly the time is about the same) but as much as 10 weeks of that time is brooding. I have been lucky enough to have had a couple of large egg females to brood viable eggs and was able to raise a few of the young (very low success rate but a couple survived that I raised through adult).

    Do watch for eggs with a flashlight. I would suggest trying to remove them if you can catch them early enough as there is not chance of survival. The paper I saw (sadly I did not record where I saw it and need to try to find it again) mentioned that it must be within 24 hours or removing the eggs has no effect.
     
  12. mreef

    mreef Larval Mass Registered

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    so you are saying that a male, when there is no reproduction, will not really live longer... you will just see him till his last moment, is that right?

    it's really sad that they die so fast :(
    I fall in love with octopus with my Little Miss Puddle, they are so fascinating!!
    but I'm not sure I'll try again since it's so hard to know if it's a male or female and to know the age of the specimen that you buy (let alone the species)
     
  13. DWhatley

    DWhatley Cthulhu Staff Member Moderator

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    Mating, in spite of the literature, is not the reason for decline. As near as we can tell (and forgive my laymen's explanation), the sexual maturation process begins the aging and the optic gland appears to signal time to mature. A couple of studies removed this gland (it does not blind the animal) and they lived twice the normal lifespan (which is still short, the expected lifespan for the size we keep in home aquariums is 12-18 months). Interestingly, if a part of the gland is reimplanted, it starts the maturation process. Removing the gland after maturation starts, however, does not halt the aging.

    Males become senescent, as do females but it is less obvious unless they live beyond a normal hatching period, most die within a day or two of a hatching (or the time eggs would hatch if they were not viable) but several species have a slightly different time clock. Both stop eating. Senescent males are known to do unusual things like wander aimlessly or even climb up on land. Most of mine have just stopped eating over about a two week period, become lethargic and no longer interact. I have a video of one male that insisted on moving sand from one end of the tank to the other (Unfortunately, it is no longer available on-line). It is both comical and sad.

    There is no question that the hardest part of keeping them is losing them. The only worst scenerio is having an empty tank and likely the reason I keep multiples.
     

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