major problem

Discussion in 'Octopus Care' started by joefish84, Dec 25, 2005.

  1. joefish84

    joefish84 Sepia elegans Registered

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    of course i go out of town for a week and someone else watches the octo only for my return to be upsetting... the tank has nitrates through the roof and the octo is not eating... just sits there for the most part then will panic a little and swim around... did a big water change and waiting for the results but meanwhile are there any other suggestions? he doesnt look to happy pushes food away and is kinda holding his sleeping colors and spreads out alot in front of his den. so upset. hope the water change will make him happier! also it looks like he may have nipped at one tenticle at some point cause the end of it is a slight nub... hope its not the dreaded "A" word! please dont let it be that. anyway anymore suggestions would be nice like if i should sing to it or something
     
  2. Nancy

    Nancy Titanites Staff Member Moderator

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    A major water change is the best thing to do - by major, what do you mean? I think Carol does up to 50%

    Is it only the nitrates, or do you have high nitrites and ammonia? How high are the nitrates? Octos can tolerate higher nitrates, but it could affect eating. Test your water again now that you've done a water change and see what the reading are. Also, are pH and sg OK?

    You know,we haven't discussed this much, but it's possible octos suffer stress when their owner goes away, especially if you play with him a lot. My bimac would sulk if I went away for a day since I was there so much of the time. I eventually did not leave her alone for more than 1/2 day. I have heard reports of this, but of course, we don't know for sure.

    Hope Kashmir's OK - after all those pics, I feel I know him.

    Nancy
     
  3. cthulhu77

    cthulhu77 Titanites Supporter

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    Yep, large water change, and what the heck...sing !
     
  4. joefish84

    joefish84 Sepia elegans Registered

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    well this morning hes still alive but just sitting on the front of the tank... i did 20 gallon change last night due to a lack of ro water and about to do another 30 which will be over a 50% change hopefully he'll cheer up some more. last night he perked up a little bit and moved around while i was doing the change like he new what i was doing and he was getting excited.
     
  5. corw314

    corw314 Colossal Squid Staff Member Moderator

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    If you remember, Gimpy used to get my attention when there was an ammonia spike. I did over 50 percent and changed the carbon. This seemed to perk him up almost immediately. Have you checked the ammonia? Keeping fingers crossed for you and Kashmir!

    Carol
     
  6. joefish84

    joefish84 Sepia elegans Registered

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    yeah the ammonia and nitrates and everyother thing was off so ive done a 40 gallon change on a 75 system and im waiting for the results good idea on the carbon i need to pull mine out...
     
  7. joefish84

    joefish84 Sepia elegans Registered

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    alright im off to the store again to get more salt, buffer and carbon...
     
  8. joefish84

    joefish84 Sepia elegans Registered

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    oh yeah i think i know what happened though... i talked to the feeder at the charleston aquarium the other night and when she goes out of town the octos there throw tempertantrums and purposly mess up the water to try and get attention from her. i think that kash did the same thing because everything was fine with the water and all untill friday and then he decided he'd let the food that he was given rot and started to dig up the substrate messing everying up and clogging overflows causing the nitrates and ammonia to skyrocket... bet he feels stupid now huh? oh well at least he missed me
     
  9. main_board

    main_board Vampyroteuthis Supporter

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    That is really really interesting! I would have had no idea that an octopus would be capable of such...feelings! Man, I just got to get me one of these! Has anyone else had similar experiences? For comparison: I know that thoroughbreds (hot-blooded horses) can lose up to 10 pounds an hour from pacing and sweating if they're left alone and no human that they are familiar with is around! Amazing creatures (both octopus and horses, though for obvious reasons I'm not a big fan of thoroughbreds).

    Cheers!
     
  10. TidePool Geek

    TidePool Geek O. vulgaris Registered

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    Hi M_B,

    It's actually pretty common for an octopus to respond to what's going on outside the tank. OTOH: It's probably not accurate to say that Kashmir refused to eat because it "missed" Joefish. It's more likely that Kashmir either disliked or distrusted the substitute for reasons that we will never understand.

    A couple of years ago I visited the (now defunct) Poulsbo Marine Science Center in Poulsbo WA. While I was there a volunteer was trying to feed their GPO - and failing. I visited with the guy for 15 minutes or so while he tried to get the octo to eat some squid. I asked if maybe the octo just didn't like dead food but he assured me that this GPO loved dead squid and that the other volunteers that took turns feeding (I think there were three authorized feeders) had no trouble at all feeding the big guy. It was apparently a simple case of dislike at first sight.

    We've never had that problem at the Feiro Marine Life Center in Port Angeles, WA, where I volunteer. We exclusively feed live crabs and the GPO never comes to associate the prey with the people. It's a bit like leaving a bowl of dry food out for a cat - when it gets hungry it will go and eat. We try to keep at least one crab in the GPO tank at all times. Sometimes, when a crab is added it doesn't even make it to the bottom of the tank before being grabbed. Other times it might last several hours before its demise. In any case, we never have uneaten food in the tank since the crabs pretty much transition directly from 'live animal' to 'consumed food'.

    Conversely, we did have a GPO several years ago that would get very upset if a visitor in red clothing approached the tank. There's a disputed school of thought that, in GPO's at least, red denotes anger or aggression so maybe it was interpreting the red clothing as a rival wanting to fight. The thing is that we get a different GPO every year (occasionally we get more than one), we've been open for 20+ years, and I'm pretty sure that it was just that one GPO that didn't like red.

    Maybe it's a case of buying an Octopus vulgaris, O. bimaculoides, or O. joubini and having it transform into O. murphyi upon entering the home tank.

    Emotionally yours,

    Alex
     
  11. joefish84

    joefish84 Sepia elegans Registered

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    well... after a 40 gallon water change here are the results...

    nitrates~75 still high...
    ammonia~0 YEAH!!!!!
    nitrites~little more than 0 ehh...what can you do
    changed all carbon(which was alot...)

    octo
    still sitting under a rocking looking pale and pushing anything i give to him away...
    singing... still not working going to try interpritive dance...
    feeding... havent tried in a while but not going to till he cheers up but i did put in 5 ghost shrimp... these will die before anything else if the water is still bad... kindof a death clock for the tank...

    water problem... well of course because my existing water has poor ionic balance the new water when mixed with it becomes cloudy... go figure... sooo.....

    solution... another water change!!!! probably 20 - 25 gallons

    any suggestions anyone going to scream NOOOO!!!! and stop me if im doing something wrong because at this point if i do this i will be doing almost a full tank change!!! but ive only done 20 at a time so as not to shock him out.


    see what happens when you go out of town for a week... also my reef tank has nuked out and ive lost probably 2 grand in corals!! woo hooo!!!! i feel so good and happy right now...
     
  12. Nancy

    Nancy Titanites Staff Member Moderator

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    Well, maybe he'll pick up eventually - sure hope so.

    Make sure the water has aged a while after you add the salt - I use a small pump to mix it. Overnight is good, but at least 4 or 5 hours.

    Nancy
     
  13. monty

    monty Colossal Squid Staff Member Supporter

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    I really hope Kashmir will be ok-- it sounds like you're really doing everything you can for him. Sorry I don't have any helpful suggestions, but I wanted to let you know I'm cheering you on!

    Maybe you should videotape the interpretive dance, so that when it solves the problem other octo owners can try it as well!
     
  14. joefish84

    joefish84 Sepia elegans Registered

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    ill do that!! anyway yall look at my thread in journal forum and give me your opinion cause im thinking too much and getting some good bad ideas and need some help... mentally... about to have a breakdown... must get something... need some... help... please... must have....
     
  15. monty

    monty Colossal Squid Staff Member Supporter

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    Wow, that sounds like pretty clear evidence that GPOs have some level of color vision... that's very curious-- I just did some googling on things like "octopus color vision" and "dofleini rhodopsin" and it looks like GPOs are actually the "standard" for ceph rhodopsin, so it seems very well understood that they only have one visual pigment-- so how can they tell red? I found a few intersting links there, I'll post them over in the Physiology and Biology department...
     
  16. joefish84

    joefish84 Sepia elegans Registered

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    well hes come out more and now hes just glued to the back wall with the end of his tenties hanging down below kinda curly like a corkscrew yet his breathing is almost back to normal... now the gpo at the columbia zoo was doing this last time i saw it then i found out from the curator that it was about to die... is this true or am i just hoping for the aquarium to be half full?
     
  17. joefish84

    joefish84 Sepia elegans Registered

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    heres what the gpo in the columbia zoos tenties were doing and it's dying... now heres kash's...
     

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  18. joefish84

    joefish84 Sepia elegans Registered

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    any input?
     
  19. corw314

    corw314 Colossal Squid Staff Member Moderator

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    Unfortunately, that curlyque look is not good. Almost every octopus I have ever seen with this does not make it. I hope I'm wrong this time...Keeping fingers still crossed....
     
  20. joefish84

    joefish84 Sepia elegans Registered

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    yeah thats what i figured
     

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