This stuff can be confusing, and there are a lot of conflicting statements made, which doesn't help. I'll try to clarify:
temet vince;174731 said:
Ok, so obviously anyone could catch live bimacs from California, breed them, and begin selling them as a business without getting caught, since no one can stop you from taking them home for your own use, and once they are "home", no one can prove you got them from the ocean.
They don't need to prove you got them from the ocean. The law you would be breaking would be selling california native species without a "marine aquaria collector's permit" or "marine aquaria receiver's permit" (regardless of where you got them). And those permits specifically exclude bimacs.
temet vince;174731 said:
Someone mentioned that you need a Scientific Collectors permit
"Someone" is wrong. I can collect an octopus with a fishing license. I can then eat it, use it for fish bait, or keep it alive indefinitely, but I can't sell it, or use it for any commercial purpose.
temet vince;174731 said:
The law was blatantly obvious that bimacs cannot be collected with a Marine Aquaria Collector's permit.
So is there no possible way, even with an infinite amount of starting capital, for any company to legally start breeding bimacs?
According to a letter from DFG on the topic, I can breed them, but I can't sell the babies (but I could give them away). I think that there are places that breed them for scientific and education purposes, and I think they sell them to approved institutions (and maybe teachers), so there must be a way to get a permit to do it, at least for that market and those purposes.
If someone caught a gravid female bimac, and took her out of state, and then sold the babies while in say Texas, would it be legal? What if they bred them in Texas and sold the babies from there. It would be illegal to collect the female for a commercial purpose in the first place, so collecting her for the purpose of selling the babies would be a violation. Could you be prosecuted by Ca once you've left the state? Would selling the babies be a violation of California law, since it's not happening in Ca? I don't know The whole thing seems unethical to me, and might be illegal, and might even be actionable. It's an open question as far as I know.
temet vince;174731 said:
"Specifically, Section 8597(b)(2)(H) states that all species of octopus may be taken EXCEPT O. bimaculatus and O. maculoides. (note - maculoides is an error - should read bimaculoides)."
Yes, It's a typo, and I suspect that the judge would know that, ignore the mistake, and apply the law as if the word read "bimaculoides". I'm not a lawyer, but I strongly doubt that the wheels of justice stop turning for every typo in the code, and I certainly wouldn't challenge the law based on that typo.
I think it's more useful to point out that the section of law you quoted (8597) talks about what you are allowed, and not allowed, to take
with a marine aquaria collector's permit. That section only applies to people who are collecting for the marine aquaria pet trade. It does not apply to fishermen, using a fishing license, taking animals for their own use (or to give away).
Here's how the section starts:
"8597. (a) It is unlawful for any person to take, possess aboard a boat, or land for marine aquaria pet trade purposes any live organisms identified in subdivision (b), unless that person has a valid marine aquaria collector's permit..."
It gets a little confusing when you look at the definition of "marine aquaria pet trade":
"8596. The following definitions govern the construction of this article:
(a) "Marine aquaria pet trade" means any activities connected with collecting, holding, selling, and displaying live aquatic marine life for pet, hobby, curio, or display purposes."
Does that definition include a guy like me who's "hobby" is keeping an octopus, and "displaying" it in my aquarium at home? The answer is no, and I know that because that question was specifically asked, and answered by the DFG in the letter shown in post #23 of this thread, which says:
"1. Maintaining live sport-taken octopus in a home aquarium should not be considered "display" as used in FG sections 8596-97 re: Marine Aquaria Pet Trade. Therefore, octopus may be maintained in a personal aquarium and do not fall under the provisions requiring a Marine Aquaria Collectors permit."
So just keep in mind that Sections 8596-8598 apply to commercial collectors, not to us. There are things we can take that they can't, including bimacs.