Hey guys. I have been reading around here and decided to drop my reef plans and set up my 55g tank for an Octopus. My questions are:

Should I get LR? How much LR should I get?

What type of Octopus should I get?

What type of equipment will I need?

What should I feed it?

What temp does it like the water to be?

Do I need any lighting? What type?

How do you properly acclimate it?

Where should I order it from? My LFS doesnt carry them.

How should the tank be set-up?


Sorry I have soo many questions, but I just want to get this info before hand. Thanks for any help!!!

answers to most, if not all, of those questions can be found in the articles under the "ceph care" tab above... you may want to start there...

First of all yes live rock is very important the mor the better it makes the octo feel more at home!

I think you should get a bimac but thats just my opinion!

You will need low to medium light levels, proper filtration, skimmer ect.

You should feed him live fiddler crabs if ya can get them, live or frozen shrimp well check the article what are you
feeding your octopus! that will give you a better understanding of the feeding!

Water should be around 76 degrees!

Again low to medium light levels.

Acclimation should be done using the drip method!

If you want a bimac I recomend WWW.OCTOPETS.COM!

Finally it should be setup with proper equptment and should be cycled at a minimum of 3 months!

If ya have anymore questions feel free to ask me or any of the other tonmoers! Oh and I almost forgot, WELCOME TO TONMO

That article helped alot. Thanks for that. Where can I get fiddler crabs? Also, on www.octopets.com, the Octopus package comes with clams. Can I just keep buying those maybe? Do I need a sump to keep everything in? I bet it would be alot easier. Can I hand feed it from the start? About the lighting, I have an old normal output flourecent freshwater lamp. Will that do OK? Or should I get a saltwater lamp? Am I going to need a powerhead or 2? If so, what should I use to cover the openings up? Thanks soooo much!!!

Octos dont really have lighting requirements - just use a bulb that you think looks good, aslong as it isnt blinding it should be fine. You dont need power heads, they can be dangerous and the octo doesnt need current like corals do.
I decided to go with a sump, and I realised it has made things much easier - apart from dealing with octo proofing the overflows and return piping. Im gonna use my sump to house all my feeders-, but most go with a seperate tank for that altogether.

I think (although not sure) that the clams are good food while the octo is small, but as he gets bigger you will need to sus out bigger food.

Here's a link to a thread about food ect.
http://www.tonmo.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3728

I think I am going to go with a sump. I have a 10-15g tank laying around that I will use. I will put everything in there. What foods are better when they get bigger? Where can I get them? I think I will do what you do, and store the live feeders in the sump. And about the powerheads... isnt it bad to not have one curculating the water? The water will basically just sit there without a powerhead. Thanks

Well if you are running a sump you will need a return pump - which will give some water movement. I havent really heard if relativly dead water is a problem for the octo - other than having less oxygen ect.

Have you got your skimmer sorted? You will need live rock too.

For my sump, I have water from the overflows split via a T junction with a ball valve - the majority of water goes to the skimmer(left section),
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b279/Feelers/Sump.jpg
With the retun pump in the middle, and the right section is the refugium for the food and a DSB(in my case :grin:)
There are baffles between the skimmer and return to get rid of microbubbles.

Some good advice here from Feelers. One thing you want to make sure of though, that the old tank that was laying around has never had any copper medication used in it...the copper will seep out, and kill the ceph very quickly.
Using a sumped system is by far the easiest way to go, many, many advantages.
You might want to read more about the bimac's food requirements, and make sure you can provide an ample supple of fresh crab meat or the like...luckily, with places like shrimpstuff.com (shameless plug here), fresh food is only an email away ! Many of our members have been able to coax their bimacs into eating frozen bits of lobster and crab too...just be sure to vary the diet often, so they don't get bored.
greg

Do I need baffles? I am acually thinking about just getting this wet/dry http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=3589&N=2004+22778 and using the sump area for my skimmer and return pump. Maybe throw a little mechanical filter in the sump also. Is this a good choice? Lets say I bought this right now... what else will I need exactly to have it running?


OR should I just use my extra 10g tank as a sump. Can I keep the live feeders in the sump area in the wet/dry I showed you above? I am just confused as to use the sump or the wet/dry + sump. I want to keep live feeders in the sump but with the wet/dry, im not sure if its OK. Thanks!

Well, that looks like a nice sump. Kind of pricey, but workable. I would definitely recommend getting a canister filter of some sort to run the water through, as the amount of waste that a ceph produces is quite substantial.
As far as the "baffles" go, that would be up to you and how you want to set up the filter...probably would not be a bad idea, though.

The thing with this wet/dry and sump is that it has all types of filter media and such. And I can place any type of filter media in the drawers. I may put a little power filter in the sump but nothing much. Do you think it will be OK to put feeders in the sump area (crabs, clams, maybe some shrimp, ect)? or do you think they will just dirty up the water and die in there. Please help! Thanks

I would personally recommend against that particular overflow and wet/dry. Kind of flimsy. I own the overflow part of it, and it wouldn't hold siphon right out of the box (!) and had to be re-siliconed.

I personally recommend drilling the tank for the overflow. You can get a diamond-coated holesaw for glass cutting off eBay for $10 shipped. If you don't trust yourself some LFS and glass shops will do it for a bit more. If you don't want to drill it, use a siphon overflow with a "u-tube," basically a curved cylinder. The long skinny siphons used in CPR and Marineland overflows like to trap bubbles.

Here are a few sources for quality U-tube overflows:

http://www.lifereef.com/
http://store.hurricanefilters.com/

Both of these places sell wet/dry filters, too. Notice the Marineland wet/dry in your link is just a plastic tub. Most you will find are actually acrylic boxes, quite a bit more rugged.

If you want to save money find used equipment. Its a little more risky (copper) but you can save a fortune. My 29 gallon sump cost me $10. The Aquamedic TF1000 skimmer inside it cost me $5 :). Also check out eBay: I have 5 gallons of bioballs being shipped to me for $15.

I hope this helps, I've just been through the equipment wringer :)

Dan

Edit: I just remembered the thread is about a 55 gallon tank. Older 55s are usually made with all tempered glass, and very bad things happen when you try to drill these. Just to let you know that you should check it out in case you do decide to drill it or have it drilled.

Do you think it will be OK to put feeders in the sump area (crabs, clams, maybe some shrimp, ect)? or do you think they will just dirty up the water and die in there. Please help! Thanks

This is why most people go with a seperate tank - I'm gonna give it a go though - its just easier for me given my situation. Its probably a good idea to keep it seperate - but I wanna have a few other animals in the system.

I see. I think what I am going to do is connect my 10g tank to the wet/dry and use the sump for my live feeders and maybe just 1 more power filter. Does anyone have any ides on how this can be done?

Do you have a return pump?
Also I dont think you'll need a power filter, it will clog up fast, require constant cleaning, and provide little filtration. Let your w/d handle that. You could put carbon or something in it though.

Disagree with that bit. Cephs put out large packets of waste, and often...you need a can filter to strain it out, or it will muck up your system quickly!

Oh, so I am going to need to hook up another canister filter to the sump!? Is the Fluval any good? What about the Magnum?

I like the magnet driven can filters, like the Magnum...but a lot of people prefer Fluval and Eheims. They all work well, I just like the ease of maintenance.

Alright, I think i got this down. Now... I have a feeding question. If I order my Octo from Octopets.com, I would order the package with the clams. Can I feed him the clams until they are all gone? Do I just drop them in the tank? Also, after I finish all the clams, I would probably order shrimp from shrimpstuff.com. What size should I order and how many should I feed him every day (both clams and the shrimp). Thanks

Well, a lot of that is subjective...how much it eats, etc. I would recommend starting him off on a variety of foods early on. Carol and the others will be able to chime in and offer you a more accurate count of "how much", as my work has all been done with dwarf octos, not bimacs. (until next spring...:))

I used to feed Henry everyday, a couple, or three clams a day, he decided that he didn't like his tank, so only a couple months (about 8 weeks) to gauge. And there was always 'round 20 hermits in the tank with him.I don't know at what rate he ate those, but they definately were eaten by him. Hope this helps.

Felix.

So should I just feed him clams from octopets.com and shrimp from shrimpstuff.com?

Ok, I have a very good question here. I think my dad got me a ViaAqua MultiSkimmer which is a skimmer and filter all in one. It is rated at 200 gph. So I was wondering if that is bad? http://www.aquaticexchange.com/product_info.php?cPath=187_242&products_id=313 Will I need more flow? ALso, I think I am buying a wet/dry which will be attached to a sump to put it in. But, should I tell my dad to take it back and get a normal skimmer thats better? Or should I keep it. Becuase if i test it, I wont be able to take it back. LMK, because I know reefs need TONS of flow (I think in a reef u need to turn ur tank over at least 8 times in an hour), but I dont know about octos.

So should I just feed him clams from octopets.com and shrimp from shrimpstuff.com?
Hi binaryT -- I can tell you that from what I've observed, my customers who are feeding their saltwater pets are most interested in the small (1/4 - 1/2 inch) shrimp, although some go for the mediums. The smalls are the most cost-effective, and octopuses have fun catching them (by all appearances, it's much more rewarding than frozen shrimp on a stick). A separate feeder tank is pretty much a requirement, of course.

The larges are typically ordered for larger specimens or for other purposes... we also get special orders for much larger shrimp (up to 3 inches and more) for various non-ceph purposes.

I'm no ceph-keeping expert, but am offering my observation based on what I've heard from others who have ordered from me... we definitely have the expertise in this forum to offer more suggestions, but this is what I've seen, for what it's worth!

Welcome to the community!

I see, I think I will use your method with the small shrimp. What about the clams though? Should I get them or not bother? ABout the feeder tank, what will I need in there exactly? Can I use a sump as a feeder tank? Thanks!

Hey BinaryT, when you said "power filter" I figured you mean the little in-tank things that are common in fresh water tanks - which really arent suitable. :grin:
http://www.justmarine.co.uk/graphics/00000001/clearjet2.jpg
Like this thing ^

200 gph isn't going to be enough as the only filter, but if it is used as a stable filter, and you have another running carbon, etc, you would be ok. Still a big fan of the Magnum series, just due to ease of cleaning.

I see, so should I take it back and get a good preotein skimmer, and buy a Magnum with my own money?


EDIT: After looking at these for awhile and browsing the reef forums, I am questioning setting this up for an Octopus. It seems so hard and so much work. So please, someone tell me if a reef is easier or an Octo.

Well, they are different. A ceph tank is much more like "large cichlid" sort of tank...lots of filtration, a lot of security features, etc., whereas a reef tank is more fine tuned in regards to lighting, water movement...

I love both. If you are uncertain, I would go for the reef tank ...cephs are the most rewarding animals I have ever worked with, but they do demand faithfullness that borders on insanity !

Well, I was looking around and was leaning towards the Octopus tank again. I am just worried that it wont ever show its self and I will be bored out of my mind. Plus the reef tank will be a [edit] load of money (lighting, corals, all the LR, ect).

Note: Edited by tonmo to remove adult language

IMHO I think they are both worth considering. If I had the greenbacks I would do both. I lean towards cephs, because much like any intelligent pet, they have a personality that only you as an individual will be able to appreciate. I wouldn't say this is an endorsement for either setup, all I am saying is you have to extract what you would like, beauity and longevity (many well kept reefs will outlive any pet you will ever get, except maybe birds) or interactivity and noticible behavior that you would be hard pressed to find in any other water born pet. However there is a price, they're short lived.

"Brought to you by the makers of Snacky S'Mores!"

BT:Uh, I'm laughing...but you might want to edit that last post...this is the kid friendly part of tonmo!:grin:

I've kept a lot of octos, and never once was bored at all...if you are as interested as it sounds, I would say go for it !

Any salt water tank takes some planning and some ongoing work, so I wouldn't call either a reef tank or an octopus tank "easy".

You could have a reef tank but limit yourself to what is easy to keep (like mushrooms) and sturdy invertebrates (like cleaner shrimp).

If you're worried about being bored by your octopus, maybe you should choose the reef tank.

Nancy

I just did heaps of reading about peoples tanks ect as I knew nothing of reef keeping or octopuses for that matter.
I try to follow reefing as in my opinion it is more complicated(you need to worry about flow, lighting, calcium levals ect). Octos have their own set of problems though when it comes to things like octo proofing and feeding ect.

If you took a random off the street and showed them all the peices of a reef aquarium its pretty overwhelming, but as you learn about water parameters ect. and get used to it, its not as scary as it seems.

When people ask me what my sump is(as its sitting in the middle of my flats living room), it's still hard to explain. :grin:

Yeah, I agree with you guys. I am going to go with the Octopus tank. How many times should the tank get turned over in a hour? I know reefs need like 8-10 times, but what about Octo's? Is it OK to put 1 powerhead in the tank> Where do you buy stuff to cover the openings (like little holes and such from powerheads and filter inputs/outputs)? thanks for all you help!

P.S. Sorry about the bad language. LOL. I wont do it again.

Also, about the live feeders, is it OK to keep them in the sump with the filter and the protein skimmer? WIll they swim around (shrimp) and get into the pumps and filters and such? LMK Thanks! Also what skimmer would you reccomend?

You wont need a powerhead, the octo might get its arm caught and there really isnt any need for it - unlike a reef tank where the corals need high flow, an octo doesnt have such requirements. As long as the filtration is working and the skimmer is oxygenating the water - flow in the tank isnt really a requirement. (Does anyone know if they have a preferance of high or low flow? , I'm just interested :grin:)

I dont know much about that sump design so I dont know about the feeders. I would imagine that its probably not the best situation for them though.
With my sump there is an entirely seperate compartment which I can adjust the flow ect, and the feeders wont be able to get sucked into the return. :grin:

Oh, OK. But if I had a seperate feeder tank, what would I need in there? Would I need a filter and heater and all that? How big should the tank be? Can it be like 5g? Less!? It wouldbe pretty easy to just buy a cheap power filter and a small tank. Thanks and lmk!

A ten gallon with a side power filter should suffice for the feeders...and it is cheaper than a five gallon !

Lol thats true. Do you have any reccomendations on the power filter? Should I get the HOB type or the in tank type?

For use with the feeders, a hang on the back Whisper or the like is the best way to go...they tend to clog up the in-tank jobs quickly.

Yeah, but what about this one http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=3610&N=2004+22769 if I got the 70, it would filter 300 GPH. Is that one good? can I keep them at room temp? Will I need anything else but a filter? They will be stored in there for awhile because I am gonna order them in bulk. Thanks for all you help!!!

Well, it depends on your room temperature. I would imagine that they will be fine though.
300gph in a ten gallon is somewhat overkill...you might want to go a bit lower. :grin:
As far as additional stuff, some live rock and shells, etc, would make them feel a bit more at home, right?

Lol, but then how am I going to catch them? I dont really care if they feel like home HAHA but as long as they dont die from it.

Well, you have to get your exercise, you know. At least, that is what Richard Simmons says.

But is it OK to have them in a plain tank with nothing in it? Just a filter.

Nah...a little tank with some algae and live rock would be much better...they are still easy to catch out of there, and the tank will be an attraction of it's own.
We aren't talking about a full blown reef tank, just a few pounds of live rock and some macroalgae.

Ok, thats cool. Would it be OK if I keep them in a plain tank until I get LR and Macroalgea? Also, can I put a good amount of Macro in the tank with the Octo to help in filtration and make it look better? Which would you suggest for macro?

Yay! I just got all of my equipment and water, lus 40lbs. of LR for my tank. I set up a sump also. It is all running now. I just need to put something in there to start cycling. I am sooo excited that this is accually happining!!! I will post pics later.

Very cool, congrats! Looking forward to the pics.

Thanks. Now for future refrences... does Octopets.com have an Arive-Alive guarentee? If not then I am not ordering from them.

They have the industry-standard guarantee: If it arrives dead, they'll send you another granted you're willing to pay shipping again.

Dan

Is shipping included in the cost? How much is it? I am thinking of buying from liveaquaria.com instead.

Shipping is not included in the cost. You can usually expect around $30-40 for shipping from any online fish seller. Most have shipping FAQs on their websites--Most also have extra handling and "box" charges.

As far as I'm aware all aquacultured bimacs ultimately come from Octopets, but they do distribute eggs. Call them before you order and ask them if it was raised in-house from an egg or if it was shipped live from their distributor. In either case, ask how old it is and how big it is.

Dan

Well I will order from live aquaria along with plenty of hermits. They said theres are typically 1-2 inches big

I got pics!!!

The tank is currently cycling with shrimp. the skimmer is breaking in, and everything is looking good! Trying to decide of I should leave that room in the middle for him to swim or not.

55g tank
10g sump
wet/dry filter
ViaAqua SK300 skimmer
40lbs. LR (live rock)
40lbs. LS (live sand)

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y179/texasjoehotdog47/DSCN2046.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y179/texasjoehotdog47/DSCN2049.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y179/texasjoehotdog47/DSCN2047.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y179/texasjoehotdog47/DSCN2048.jpg

I am kind of thinking not to get an Octopus. I dont know why. Are they alot harder to feed than fish? Do they die in the mail all the time? This guy at the LFS said that Octo's are practically impossible to keep, and that kind of got me thinking. Help me out! I am just not sure if Octo's are really hard or not.

Your LFS guy is probably used to getting blue rings, which have a tendency to do all the things he described. Most LFS don't even know that you can order an octopus that's aquacultured specifically as a pet.

Your setup looks pretty good for an octo, though. Since you're here you obviously have an interest, you're competent at setting up a tank, why not go ahead and order one after the tank matures?

Feeding it shouldn't be that big of a deal. Have clams and little hermits when its tiny, then start working in live and thawed frozen shrimp and fiddlers as it grows.

Dan

Should I order it from octopets, or liveaquaria? Can I keep small hermits in the tank for him to eat, like 10 or so of them. So as he gets hungy, he can eat. Will I need live shrimp? It is exspensive and if he doesnt need therm, I wont get them right away. Maybe not at all.

Another thing to keep in mind is usually when you see an octo at a fish store, they're keeping it locked in a tiny empty critter cage inside an aquarium so it doesn't escape and customers can see it. You can see why they don't have any luck getting octos to eat or thrive in this kind of a situation.

Now given that, putting your baby bimac in a critter cage in your aquarium for a few weeks isn't a bad idea if you put some sand and rock and PVC in it. The idea being a 55 or 75 gallon tank can be a big and dangerous world for a 1" octo.

If you don't want to shell out for the live shrimp, I don't think it will be a big problem. I'm sure you could keep a bunch of hermits in there and he would enjoy hunting them. Remember the clams like to burrow, so you might try to put a little dish "feeding area" in there that you can set the clams (and later thawed frozen shrimp) on.

Dan

PS - I don't think it matters too much where you order from. I don't know if anyone here has ordered from Live Aquaria, so you may consider ordering from them just to add another data point. Fishsupply.com also sells them.

Is anyone going to mention anything about that stand?

Nice job binaryterror! I like ths stand, rot iron and dark wood would match my wine rack well! Neat set up too, i would have never thought to seperate the Wet dry and skimmer in seperate tanks. Good luck!

Thanks! The skimmer finally started making foam last night, and the microbubbles from the skimmer has drastically reduced. The wet/dry is working perfectly. All it needs now, is to mature/cycle. What would you recommend... me keeping the center open (for him to swim/walk around), or put things in there like PVC (so he can hide/play). I cant decide which would be better. Also, does anyone know what the levels of the water should be? I am also, over the weekend, going to buy a piece of plexi-glass from Lowes. It will be a custom cut lid. Fit perfectly. My question is, how can I seal of the 2 overflow boxes?

Also, will Octo's eat Lionfish? Will they eat Stingrays?

Do not put anything in with your octo. The thing that goes around and people repeat is that "if you put an octo in your tank it will eat all your fish." This has certainly been true, and people have had their lionfish eaten by their octopus. However, if you put a bimac in that's 1" across, those other fish are going to be the predators.

The bottom line is if you put an octo in a tank with fish (even a damsel) it is going to have a very negative effect on the octopus. He's going to stay in his den all day, living in fear. You are not going to get the interaction or the viewing enjoyment that most octo-keepers value. These are sensitive creatures.

You're in a pretty good position right now because you aren't 100% certain if an octo is what you want to keep, but the tank isn't stocked yet. An octopus has a short lifespan, so if you order one when the tank is ready, he'll probably die by next summer or fall. At that point you can say "Hey, this was a real good experience, I'll get another" or "Gee, this isn't for me, I'll get some fish." OTOH, If you go ahead and get fish in the next few months, you're precluding yourself from ever keeping an octo in that tank.

Now that I'm done with that tirade, I would distribute the rock a little bit more, so it isn't in piles. You might also get some underwater epoxy from your fish shop and build some caves with it. A few PVC fittings (rinsed very well) would probably be good.

Dan

Ok, well that isnt good. I just bought 6 Damsels to help cycle the tank. When the tank is done cycling, what should I do with them? What if I just let the Octo eat them?

Damsels can get pretty aggressive, particularly in groups. They've been known to strike at an octopus' eyes. I've been bitten by damsels while trying to do tank maintenance.

Sometimes a fish shop will take damsels back, but this is uncommon and don't expect much, if any, money. ReefCentral has buy/sell/trade forums, so you might be able to give them away there. They're hardy fish, so you might consider setting up a little 20 with a powerfilter and a few pieces of live rock and keeping them.

Dan

Yeah, when I bought them today, my little brother thought it was sooo cool. He keeps checking up on them and such. So i said "Hey, when I am ready for my Octopus, I will need to get rid of these. Do you want to set up a 20g tank for them? Maybe it could helpyou get started into saltwater aquariums." His eyes got huge and he said yes. So I have a place to put them when I need to get rid of them. Now, will I be seeing the Octopus around the tank alot or will he be hiing the whole time, all day? I am just not sure if I want one. I really do, acually, but I am just worried that he will just hide all day.

It is hit or miss, they do have individual personalities. I think it can be guaranteed that for the first few weeks or possibly a couple of months, your octo will be pretty shy. But there are plenty of threads about the amazing interaction that people have with their pet octos after they realize where the food's coming from. Check out Lockburn's thread about his bimac grabbing him and not letting go every time he puts his hand in the tank! Or the amazing pictures and videos of Carol's octos or Joefish's recently departed Kashmir.

Dan