Hey Everyone!

Talk about your coinsidences! I was just checking discoverychannel.ca today to check what showcase was on tomorrow and guess what....? KILLER SQUID! So excited. The Canadian premier (sp?) no less too.

From Discovery:
Killer Squid
Sun., Sept. 11 at 8 p.m. ET/9 p.m. PT
In Mexico's Sea of Cortez, fishermen talk of a sea monster, an enormous flesh-eating squid. They tell of men pulled from boats and dragged to their deaths by these real-life Krakens, monstrous carnivorous squid they call "los diablos rojos," the "red demons". From the deep waters of the Sea of Cortez, the highly-intelligent two-and-a-half metre long, 180 kilogram killer Humboldt squid makes brief visits to shallower water in search of prey - and this is where intrepid filmmakers and adventurers Mike De Gruy and Jacquie Cozens await them.

Afterwards there's a program about fishing for Alaskan King Crab. Should be a good night! I just thought I'd post to let the Canucks out there know (as I know I'd like to be informed). I imagine it would be the same schedule for our neighbours to the south, though I'm not positive. Anyways, enjoy!

Cheers, Jesse

Thanks for the heads up!

At TONMOCon, Will Gilly spent some time talking about Dosidicus and their fearsome reputation, but didn't seem to have much evidence that they ever dragged men to their deaths. *shrugs* I wonder how 'fearsome' dosies really are, though I wouldn't want to have one brassed off toward me.

Any other killer squid stories out there?

John

Just more on Dosidicus: interesting stories here: http://diver.net/seahunt/fend/f_scottc.htm actually about the documentary I believe.
Some more cool pictures here from the doco (or at least from the same guy): http://www.seacamsys.com/hb_squid.htm

Enjoy!

I'm sure DR Gilly is right but...........call me a wimp.........I have no desire to get in the water with a pack of voracious carnivores (& I have seen the stomach contents of squid!) that are bigger than me!!!!


yours wimpishly

J

Really?!?!? I think that it would be really cool to dive with them. There'd be some great risk than a normal dive, granted, but the link talks of wearing armour and the squid only tested it, realized that they couldn't do anything more, and left. I'd try it sometime, though not until and all big and growed up!

Cheers!

Yes well i know a chappie who was "nipped" by a Southern Arrow Squid (Nototodarus sloanii) much, much , much smaller than the dear old Humboldt and he needed 3 stitches in his leg, doesn't sound like much but the squid (~ 30 cm DML) had to bite through PVC over trousers, gumboots and jeans to inflict the damage!!!!!!!!!!

J

Monterey Aquarium has keeping these alive in captivity on it's agenda.

Imagine having a big, really deep pool with these, or a moat maybe, you know, something with a bridge with a hidden trap door... ah, no solicitors indeed... :madsci:

Wowza! Dangerous squidlies!

i just came back from watching it. i noticed that they seemed to press the "bloodthirsty killing machine" idea for the first half hour, and the "gentle misunderstood beastie" one for the other half. i thought that was a bit odd, but that was my only issue with it. i now know just how awesome Dosidicus are. i especially like the sucker teeth.

Imagine having a big, really deep pool with these, or a moat maybe, you know, something with a bridge with a hidden trap door... ah, no solicitors indeed... :madsci:
can we throw the discovery canada people in there? during the ad breaks, there were two commericals for new series airing next month. "canada's worst driver" and "canada's worst handyman". cripes. there goes my last remaining shred of respect for the channel.

Only if the squid like their food enriched with Molsen or Labatts!

A dosidicus would make an amzing goalie, however. Could you picture one with the skates and everything? Lightning-fast reflexes!

:canada:

wow, im ingnorat in these matters but i didnt even know that there were killer squid that could eat people. i dono if i would want to dive with them, i mean i bet some of the larger ones could pull you down and kill you, armor and all.

Yeah, mixed feelings here to. I was just thrilled to see a ceph doco on tv as I haven't caught any in a while. Most of it was all commercialized to make it interesting and sellable. I just watched it for the footage; pretty incredible. I was really surprised that the humboldts were eating krill! That whole scene was the most interesting and really took me by surprise. I was also pleased how obvious the differences in behaviour were when the squid were observed in a more natural setting. It really sucks belonging to the human race. Oh well.

Cheers!

You know, this seems like too much "razz ma tazz" science - all smoke and mirrors, with very little actual "science", if you get my meaning. Maybe I'm just getting cynical, but the current trend of "NEW SPECIES DISCOVERED" headlines with blurry photographs and no tissue samples smells a lot like Bigfoot hunts. i understand that there is a merit to making real science fun and exciting, but something is getting lost in the mix lately. I feel that most of the popular science magazines give us the scientific equivalent of a great Japanese meal served with cheap, bad sake - some good information, but an underlying insult to our overall intelligence.

The diver.net website seems so... overdramatized... like a Discovery Kids special. I will admit to some amusement by the Crocodile Hunter, but there is a satisfaction to getting through Intro to Herpetology in one piece and seeing the overall picture.

Sorry to sound like I'm brooding. Just trying to make sense of current trends in science. :grad:

John

I just finished watching it (love the DVR!), and I have to say that main_board's pretty much summed up my own feelings about it. There are several bits that I'll probably watch again, although I'm not sure I'll bother with the audio (except for Gilly's scenes). I don't see why the squid would have too many moral reservations about eating people, since I'm sure no one has got around to telling them that we are, in fact, the masters of the universe. However, it also seems unlikely to me that they would be bloodthirsty killers with a constant hankering for man-flesh. :roll: I'd guess that they would normally prefer not to attack large animals unless they calculate that the benefit of eating them would outweigh the risk of injury.

A little :feet:, but related to John's complaint (I think):

Don't dumb me down (http://www.guardian.co.uk/life/badscience/story/0,12980,1564369,00.html)

180kg? Isnt that abit overboard?

You know those New Agey therapy programs where they have people dive with dolphins for their spiritual/homeopathic wellbeing? Wouldn't it be great if they could offer that kind of therapy with dosidicus? Maybe you could even hand-feed them! "Swim with the squid! Let their tender embrace reallign your unbalanced chakras!" Of course, I suppose it would be prudent to demand cash upfront...

Its like "Incredible Suckers" where the researcher was given a warning nip instead of a full-fledged bite. Honestly speaking, I don't think the dosies viewed him as potential prey, but rather an annoyance in their territory. I mean, if they had wanted to frenzy him he'd be dead.

I think its analogous to sharks. Yes, they crave mammal meat, but MARINE mammal flesh with its high fat content. I think that most attacks on humans are probably due to our mammalian electricalchemical signatures and the shark's tendency to "take a taste" to determine if an item is food or not. Quite frankly, when you've been eating the same mammals for a few million years, a new low-fat one is pretty much a novelty... the equivalent of mildly nutritious junk food. But you will need the real thing eventually.

Man, if dosies were that dangerous, then wouldn't they be wreaking havoc on other life forms as well? And wouldn't they pack hunt or frenzy small whales or sharks? Oh well

John

They just ran this on Discovery last night and I was finally able to tape it. It was great seeing Dr. Gilly and some other familiar faces, but what was with the Muscle Beach dude in the stormtrooper armor? Is this proof at last of the controversial 'aquatic ape' theory? I mean, that armor had lots of big gaping holes at the joints that a squid should have no problem getting around. Wouldn't that shark-proof mesh armour make a lot more sense? It must be effective - it was custom made by a Hollywoood prop guy who worked on 'Star Wars'!

Beautiful, amazing creatures. I'll probably be watching this many, many times. Really makes me want to dive with them - far away from the fishing boats, of course.

I totally agree with you, on the diving bit.

It's on tonight at 7pm ET (in 1 hr. and 15 minutes) on the Discovery Channel, fyi...

Im sure if the fishermen provoke a feeding frenzy the the docis will be dangerous. But it is not like we are anything other than a prey item of opportunity. if they looked on us as a prey item then they would swarm beaches at sunset.



i can see it now- loads of stoned tourists pulled down to a watery grave to feed the old ones.............

Still big squid that might eat you - way cool.

Wow, bigGdelta - you just described my evil dream come true! I, of course, would be safely on the beach watching the whole squid/bather scenerio while sipping my martini.:glass:

spring break would be a lot more exciting. I can see the research papers now tequila flavor and squid feeding response ( to lime or not to lime, that is the question). Luckily the ocean will pre salt them.

No no no no no! Not the tasty morsels of spring break?! :grin:

All the alcohol (and various other chemicals) would probably kill the docis anyway.

I, of course, would be safely on the beach watching the whole squid/bather scenerio while sipping my martini.:glass:
Hello Erich,

Because I've just had a boilermaker, "squid/bather" read first as "squid/batter." Now I have an image of tempura-ed tourists being snacked on by Humboldts. Only another boilermaker can banish it.

:beer:

Cheers,
Clem

Hello Erich,

Because I've just had a boilermaker, "squid/bather" read first as "squid/batter." Now I have an image of tempura-ed tourists being snacked on by Humboldts. Only another boilermaker can banish it.

:beer:

Cheers,
Clem
with lime and tequila in the batter no less

Springbreak skinnydip...

Springbreak skinnydip...

:shock: Thats sweeeeet! :grin:
Sign me up!

Cheers!

I think it would be an educational experience to be in a tank with one..
Given that there be a close escape door when needed!

Rather, than a closed escape door.... gnaw, gnaw, gurgle, gurgle... :shock: :angel:

Yep, you might learn a lot, granted it might be a short and painful lesson but...

Just make sure you set up a video camera beforehand (like that grizzly bear guy...).

can we throw the discovery canada people in there? during the ad breaks, there were two commericals for new series airing next month. "canada's worst driver" and "canada's worst handyman". cripes. there goes my last remaining shred of respect for the channel.

Don't get me started about how Discovery has gone from science & nature to bikers cursing at eachother.

Don't get me started about how Discovery has gone from science & nature to bikers cursing at eachother.
What it wasn't always just home improvement and american chopper?

What it wasn't always just home improvement and american chopper?

Let's just say that my "Discovery" is that I would rather watch something else.

Even animal planet has gone to mostly reality type shows (animal pd, etc) and funniest animal instead of nature documentaries. I guess they've used up all the bbc and ozzy shows.

I'm thinking armour would be a bad idea.
You don't wanna look like a big crab......

Just thinking though, wouldn't big ockys and squid be able to smash big sea turtles?

Food in a fun to open container. They would love ya.

Where do I start.

Well first of all let me say that I do not agree with the conclusion of the discovery channel show.

Second, the muscle beach guy is named Scott Cassell. He and his "silly armor" have been diving with the squid for years now. This discovery channel show took his ideas and footage and turned it into a joke. Thats why it changes so drasticly from one side to the other.

"The divers thought Scott had the wrong Idea about the killer squid so they dove away from the boats to see a different behavior"

The only reason that they came up with the conclusion that the squid where gentle and only attacked because of an "artificial enviornment created by fishing pressure" is because people like to hear that things like Sharks, Bears, Giant Squid, and other dangerous carnivors are mearly misunderstood beasts of tranquility that are not as dangerous as past legends have made them out to be.

For the most part this to me is B.S.

Treating a dangerous animal as if it where a gentle reasonable being is foolhardy. Its through documentarys like this that people will go and think its safe to just jump in with squid because theres no "fishing going on and its broad daylight"

Well Id like to set the record straight. Squid will attack you. They are not afraid of people. They will grab and test anything that they think is food. They attack in the day and night. They attack in 2feet they attack in 130feet.

The only safe way to dive with these animals is to either protect yourself with armor or dive a cage. As you may know, armor has weak points. it is designed with yellow stripes to throw off the beak bite by directing the attack to the stripes. The armor also gives you enough time to react to the grab and fend off the animal before it has a chance to find the "chink in your armor"

The bottom line is that the real story on the squid is not what I saw on the show, Its twisted. They swim in packs, they come right up to you and check you out. You never know if the pack is going to have a big one in it or not. And you NEVER know how a squid is going to react to you in the water. They can be gentle.....untill there not.

And to prove my point

Here is footage from our last dive. Yes we have obtained sponsorship now from www.neptunic.com and we dive the chainmail also. The problem with the chainmail in 600 feet of water is that it weighs 18lbs and is unditchable. Thats one reason we prefer the panel armor over the chain on squid. Also when they get a bite in from the beak it gives you a nasty mark. The panel armor causes the beak to slide off most of the time.

Well here is the clip

http://209.242.151.5/seawolves/dancingwithdemons.wmv

We also run expeditions to dive with the Giant Humboldt Squid. We are the ones that took the Discovery Channel team and the Wild Boyz out to see whats up.

If you have ever REALLY wanted to do this dive, we are the ones that will bring you back alive.:bugout:

We have developed a dive plan that uses up two of the local pangas from the licenced fishing fleet and its crews. We use them to take out our customers to dive with. We use the panga crews local knowledge to assist us in our searches for the animals. We figure for every panga we hire from the fishing fleet to help us bring out customers we save 100 squid per night from the cannery. And we use two pangas per trip. 1 trip is 5 days. 1000squid saved per week by hiring two fishing pangas for squid divers *(aprox numbers based on what we have seen the pangeros bring in for a night)

These are awsome, intelligent creatures of the beautifull ocean. They represent the power and vitality of the sea and it alien wonder. They should be treated with respect by us humans. If someone where to dive in with these animals unprotected and unprepared because they thought that they where intelligent and gentle instead of intelligent and deadly and was to be hurt or worse, it could be some bad press for the squid. :sink: :bonk:

Squid are gentle?:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


GTB :goofysca:
www.sea-wolves.com
www.seawolvesunltd.com

My apologies to Scott Cassell for my previous snide comments. The Discovery special made him look like one of those "Extreme Sports thrill-Seeker" ESPN2 dudes, and my posting back there was needlessly insulting. :oops:

Speaking of "Killer Squid", have I got some news...

Sorry I've been so quiet as of late...

John

You leave us dangling like that?

Yeah, you and Steve...

Speaking of "Killer Squid", have I got some news...

Sorry I've been so quiet as of late...

John
And that's when he slipped and fell down the stairs twice your honor.......


come on dude spill.

Honestly, I don't mean to leave anyone dangling... to be honest, its probably nothing too earth-shattering for anyone on the board, BUT its exciting for me... I need to head to the Marine Lab tomorrow. I will post the photos ASAP. Sorry! :)

Killer Squid was on over here (UK) recently. I'm in the middle of writing my uni dissertation on natural history documentaries and this thread is brilliant stuff. I was all set writing about the misleading (if accidentally) previous squid documentaries, and wondering 'wouldn't it be obvious to ask if the squid would behave differently when not being fished' when I came across genetobaja's post on here. It just makes me wonder why DeGruy felt a need to be so clear cut. Surely if anything is learned it's actually closer to what genetobaja says- that the squid are unpredictable. So yes, sometimes they may be inquisitive and gentle, but they can also attack without provocation. Why not be content with that?

:wecome: to TONMO... there are a number of threads around that express frustration that documentaries often exaggerate controversy or danger or drama, so I suspect that's part of the reason why there are some obvious gaps in sensibility. There's a thread about a documentary on the History Channel that has some reports of the experiences of the people filmed, and the way it was reported in a great deal of detail that might be of interest for your thesis research: http://www.tonmo.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11415

good luck with your thesis... if you're allowed, please let us know when it's done and we can read it!