good point

Who wants an update????

OK I couldn't wait, so here it is. Took these while i was transferring the babes to a clean breeder net. Largest baby now about 18mm I would say.

http://www.ultimatereef.net/photopost/data/533/137429_cuttle_007_Medium_.jpg

http://www.ultimatereef.net/photopost/data/533/137429_cuttle_026_Medium_.jpg

http://www.ultimatereef.net/photopost/data/533/137429_cuttle_019_Medium_.jpg

This one shows just how much they use their "legs"

http://www.ultimatereef.net/photopost/data/533/137429_cuttle_021_Medium_.jpg

And the rearing tank:
http://www.ultimatereef.net/photopost/data/533/137429_cuttle_038_Medium_.jpg

Looks good!

I would take about 1/2 to 3/4 of the rock out of the rearing tank - otherwise they will hid and it will be hard to keep track of who is eating and who is fighting.
I found it much easier to deal with feeding and keeping tabs on the babies with a nearly empty tank, a little sand on the bottom and some macros hanging from the top of the tank. YMMV!

:D

Firstly, what is YMMV!? :lol:

Second, I dont plan to release them into the main tank Righty, just grow them on in there. I have 7 escapees in the main tank, who come out everynight to see me!!

As things progress, they'll be seperated out in more breeder nets, and then sold on. Or that's the plan anyway.

I've noticed just lately that they have really taken to eating, and perfected the stretch and grab technique. So now they are munching like demons!!

Another trip to the beach tomorrow for mysis! Really enjoying watching the progression from egg to juvy, and will be sad to see them go.

But as I said 7 escapees in the main tank. There wont be food enough for them all in there soon, so what to do? 7 is too many anyway, was thinking 3 or 4, but do i attempt to catch them before they starve?? The other thing is they will likely fight if all survive in main tank, so really need to sort something.

For the time being, I am also feeding the main tank mysis too, so fingers crossed.

Righty, have yours acclimated to diurnal habits? Or are they strictly nocturnal.

Oh, I have a small vid to, nothing exciting, but shows them - will try and do a hunting vid tomorrow. I need to get a website sorted so I can host them!!

nice to see an update again!! sounds like things are going really well! (and the tank looks good!) For free webhosting, unless you are looking to setup a really really proffessional .com (without a subdomain in the url) website try www.atspace.com or www.freewebs.com (use the latter if you dont know html or cant be bothered writing a page!) - but it does have an ugly adress (www.freewebs.com/username as opposed to www.username.atspace.com) anyway freewebs is much simpler if you dont know html... Oh and both are free to make and host a site!

Anyway looks like things are going great!

Oh, if you want an example of the types of sites you can do without any html knowledge - i made one in 5 minutes (a copy of my main website) but don't use it because you cant use certain javascripts at freewebs - www.freewebs.com/uberwack - but dont bother reading it all i havent used it in ages! - good luck with the cuttles and the site! - if you need any help with the site pm me

Firstly, what is YMMV!? :lol:

Your Milage May Vary. :D

Second, I dont plan to release them into the main tank Righty, just grow them on in there. I have 7 escapees in the main tank, who come out everynight to see me!!

Gotcha!
How are you catching the mysids?



Righty, have yours acclimated to diurnal habits? Or are they strictly nocturnal.

Whenever I walk into the room where they live, the beg for food regardless of the time of day.


Oh, I have a small vid to, nothing exciting, but shows them - will try and do a hunting vid tomorrow. I need to get a website sorted so I can host them!!

Lemmie know if I can help - if you need hosting space, I would gladly give you some on my cuttle site.

likewise i would love to know how you are catching your shrimp

Mikey.. thanks so much for your posting.. I hope to be someday following in your footsteps here in the U.S... love the updates and photos!
thanks again,
-Paul

I love how they are all lined up (or stacked up! lol!) and the 'walking' pic is great! How do you take those photos? are u using an underwater?

btw mikey is that a clarkii clown i see? And i still love skunk clowns - a lot of people say clown fish are too common and popular to be good in a reef but i still love em!

I'm somewhat of a clownfish freak actually, together with anemones and provide infor on them on the forums I mod. T

hat clown is a pretty much melanistic Clarkii, along with an A. Perideraion. Resulting of the loss of a female. Strange couple I know, just watching for any pair bonding behaviour.


Your Milage May Vary. :D

Cheers for that Righty :lol:


How are you catching the mysids?

I visit the beach with a fine net, scrape it along the surface in an area of salt/fresh meeting, and voila!! Take them home in a bit of their water, and when I get home immediately do as close to a 100% water change as possible, firstly to increase the salinity, and secondly, to get them out of murly water which fouls quickly.

First change is drip acclimation, but then any other water changes (every other day), will consist of getting the new water up to SG and teamp, then literally netting the mysis from their old water, and into their new.


How do you take those photos? are u using an underwater?

No underwater camera, just with my Digital SLR, took advantage as I was moving them to get the pics. I just use the auto macro setting.

Thanks for all your help and words guys - website hopefully sorted soon, so I can share in the vids. Will try for some hunting ones today!

sounds good - so i take it you know html?

No!!! :lol:

Nice pics Mike...

was out pricing insulation boards for the fish shed today, found some great stuff that is 3" of insulation foam sandwiched between aluminium sheets :) wont be too long...

You still got all of them? Any buyers yet?

Have all of them - no deaths! (Fingers crossed)

I have some earmarked for you mate - dont worry :lol: Also some going to a friend in an LFS in Yorkshire. Some interest in NE and also from London too!

I haven't even started advertising them for sale properly yet!

yeh i dont think youll have any problems selling them!!! lets see $10-20 x 42... lol good luck mate

Thanks! Just learning HTML at the mo! Blooming <tags> :lol:

Just when I thought jealousy couldn't reach a higher point... it just did :mrgreen:

Your cuttles are really looking great, how long are you waiting before you start to seperate them? Any chance we could get some feeding videos or pictures? :smile:

yeh mikey im not an expert but i have a few sites so if you need a hand or want me to do a bit of it for you i have the holidays coming up! It'd be nice to do a page on cuttles!

</body>
</html> ... lol!!!

OH GOD!!! i think i just made my first nerd joke!!!... i dont like the way this is going...lol - better go play basketball or something now...hahahahahaha

and tell us when the vids are up!

Just when I thought jealousy couldn't reach a higher point... it just did :mrgreen:

Your cuttles are really looking great, how long are you waiting before you start to seperate them? Any chance we could get some feeding videos or pictures? :smile:

Hi Joel, thanks for your kind words,

I plan to seperate pretty soon actually, but only by introducing one breeding net. From observations, in looks like they enjoy the security of having other in the net to snuggle up to, so will separate out to 10 a net or so.

I have been playing about with the video so will try to get some feeding shots soon!

Couple of updated close ups:

Mouth full of food:
http://www.ultimatereef.net/photopost/data/533/1374DSCF0411_Medium_.JPG

http://www.ultimatereef.net/photopost/data/533/1374DSCF0418_Medium_.JPG

very cool - did you manage to get any vids?

It looks like they are getting more colour on them is this just cos they were feeding or does this happen as they grow?

Chromatophores are active in the egg IIRC, and they colour up depending on the time of day and mood in my experience.

Even though I flood feed, one bully cuttle will still try and steal of another - when this happens their head region flashes before they pounce! :lol:

I did get some vids, but they are massive files! I need to compress them first in a suitable manner before I can publish.

Stay tuned though!

Ill buy a few. E-mail me at arabidsquid@gmail.com
thanks for posting

Hi Rabib S

As you are in CA there is very little chance that permission would b given to ship them from the UK to you and the survival rate would probably be very low. Its one of the reasons that Mikey got them as eggs. Normally they travel very poorly and have huge casualties. Even OctoPets buy their cuttlefish as eggs

Unfortunately lost a very very small juvy, that never really grew bigger than about 9 mm ML. I had seperated it last week to try and saturate feed, but alas this morning was no more. Sad, but I guess one out of 42 aint bad.

So, I have the cuttlebone and Righty said maybe an ID would be possible from it - my question, where how can I use it to ID them?

Thanks in advance,

M

Hi Mikey, best bet might be to get a pic and post it in a new thread in the physiology section of Steve's bit. He has much better ID knowledge than me :)

Thanks Col - posted pics up for Steve and the gang.

Also i know Mark Norman often includes all the cuttlebones found in the relevant area in his books on cephalopods! - I hadn't checked in on this topic for a while - sorry to hear of the loss - but as you say - i thiink you are doing an awesome job! (how big now?)

Oh and hows the website coming on?

My dad collected some more food for me and came back with not many mysis, but loads of what i think are river shrimp. The were not as big as the ones i had caught but still about twice the full length of the cuttles.

I thought they will never eat them and will be hungry - but I tried them and they certianly know how to catch and kill big prey!! So will be gradually moving onto a second food in these shrimps (or prawns??)

Also, my cuttles in the main tank are now getting used to being fed. They would at one point only come out after the whole room was in darkness - now they come out when i'm in the room and the tank lights are off - also when i feed them.

Becoming more and more convinced they are Bandensis now - extremley stumpy spined, cameleon eyes, and walking on the two arms.

Time will tell, but these guys are doing great!

If they are eating bigger food, start selling them now!

A rabid squid,
Send me a pm regarding eggs next tuesday!

where is everyone getting these eggs. it seems like people are getting them from thin air. sorry if i sound like my only use for this site is to get cuttles for my self. its just that my cuttle died and i want to get more before i get any lonelier. :shock:

They aren't coming out of thin air - I have been working for three months to get some and it isn't a sure thing until they arrive. I don't know where Mikey is getting his, but he is in another country!

And if you look back at the start of this thread, it took from January to April for me to get mine - sometimes you get a lucky break!

IF and it is a big IF, mine pair and lay, me and righty could knock heads together over shipping at egg state I suppose, but dont fancy the survival rates much.

A fair few are going next week :( some to Colin, and some more to the sea life centres round the UK. Will be holding some back to grow on further though, and sell private me thinks!

wow - sounds like you got it all sorted...lol (good work!)

still no news of vids or the site - i bet you have been pretty busy!...

And RIGHTY!!! is that an octopus on your head!!! lol - i love the picture man! and i am guessing there is a story with it???

mickey looks like your doing an awesome job i hope you can be the first to start breeding these cuttles in captivity successfully. and would love to know everything you know on how to care for cuttles i would love to put some in my 55. i saw one at a LFS the other day and it was awesome to watch feed they are so unbeliveable creatures

he wouldn't be the first - righty and a few others have done tis also - righty has a website about his experience with videos and pics - www.DaisyHillCuttleFarm.com - but still i am not game to try it yet-lol

yea i read a lot about them after i made that post and saw that righty was successful. ive seen his site its really nice.

oscar is australia pretty nice i want to move there really bad i went there on a class trip and had a blast and said i would live there some day how is it living there

Had a little experiment tonight!!

Took one dead river shrimp, and hap hazzardly tied it to some thread and floated inthe main tank - by jove the cuttles came right out and grabbed it!!

Least I know they will take dead food when i need to!

Need to find a better way of doing it though, string is hard to sink!! :lol:

Well, after the little experiment was lucky enough (or unluckly as i think it will turn out) to see 2 of my babies in the main tank square off (i think) to each other.

They were both sat side by side and then as I approached the larger cuttle changed colour and tilted sidewards to show the other it's back, strectched out as long as it could get. The colours were a brown/black/white show.

The larger one with it's back tilted moved toward the other in a pushing manner, and both had their arms splayed out. After movign around a bit, the smaller decided to grab the larger on it's tilted back. After which, they both resumed normal business.

Righty (or anyone), can you back up or explain.... pretty please??

Sound like two males squaring off. I have a video of that on my site somewhere. Gotta run, more later!

CooL! - i hope it doesnt turn into something bad as you mentioned - perhaps they will just stay away from each other if the tank is big enough? lets hope so! (have you named them all yet - lol)

Yeh australia is good but then i haven't live anywhere else for long...

Well, 6 babies have found new homes, just another 20 odd to re-home now :lol:

Just curious, how many are you keeping for yourself?

Hey Joel,

Well!! I have 10 in the main tank, of which I will remove and re-home a few if I can get them before fighting breaks out. Unfortunately, more escaped into the main tank than I hoped.

So i'm expecting some losses due to fighting, and after catching some (hopefully) fingers crossed it will leave me with maybe 3 or 4.

Even more curious... how do those guys escape? Any chance you're going to try breeding them later on?

That's the plan Joel, if i'm lucky.

They escaped while performing swaps to their breeding nets. I had originally put 6 in the main tank, as I thought this would be a good number to work with to establish a breeding group (expecting some fighting losses of course).

So if all goes to plan, I'll have some form of breeding going on. Then I may possibly maybe ( :lol: ) look into distributing the eggs.

i thought six was always the right number too when i was looking at a breeding community - almost certain sex mix - allows for some losses - allows a "choice" for the cuttles if that is important? - and allows a good number to look at and enjoy in your tank!!

More sucess with frozen dead food (after a live foods shortage :lol: ).

These guys are getting real friendly now, and all of them were waiting round, actually swimming mis water waiting to get fed!!

Took the advantage of adding crab to the menu last night, so will let you know how they get on.

I also think we need to hear from the person who took some of my babies!!

Well, all babies gone now!! Bit sad, but at same time releived I can now get the tank back in perfect order and concentrate on my own.

Fingers crossed breeding and eggs in some months down the line.

As it goes - does anyone know maturity rate, and accurate lifespan for Bandensis?

TIA

Okay okay, LOL

The 6 babes that I took are doing fine. They had their first taste of shore crab last night and all 'knew' how to approach and catch a crab without getting arms caught by claws. The crabs were all about 6-10mm accross or thereabouts.

They dont spend as much time in the sand as officinalis do but tend more to sit on the liverock and walk about on the sand.

Have a stack of varios sizes of frozen krill to try out over the next few days too.

So far so good :)

Now seeing blue dots develop on the skirt - apparently another sign of bandensis??

Well, no interest from my guys on any dead food yet... just not recognising it at all... will keep trying though.

On a cool note though, one of them was doing the 'passing cloud' display to another cuttle after it caught the shrimp and the other missed out. That's a trick that officinalis certainly never did.

Haven't seen the blue dots... i don't have lights on the tank though so maybe just more noticeable with your halides?

Possibly - tell me about the "passing cloud"?

PS: Going to put the ID to bed on these guys due to Mark Normans description (thanks for the loan of the book Col) as follows:

* Collection location
* Raised spines on the body
* Walks using the 3rd arm pair
* Small blue dots along the fin base
* Paired black markings on the rear end of the body

So......SEPIA BANDENSIS!!!!!!! (Thats what I believe anyway)

Passing cloud is when the chromatophores on the cuttle's back flash in such a way that light and dark patches on the back seem to be moving from the rear to the front of the cuttlefish... bit like clouds passing quickly...

Passing cloud video (http://www.cephschool.utmb.edu/cephschool/CSAnswers.cfm?Category=Communication&ID=220)

Once the page loads, right click on the cuttlefish video to watch again

I think bandensis too but there may possibly be other similar species in the same area ;) LOL

I don't think the blue spots are definitive - I have had some cuttles that had them, but I don't believe were bandensis -too big. The paired eye spots on the back of the mantle seems pretty definitive, but I have only seen it once in the last 2 years. I think there are a lot of sepia that share lots of the traits of the bandensis. I do think that all of the eggs I have seen come in are the same species, bandensis. :D

Sorry for the lack of updates guys, various things causing it.

Been busy trying to design a website, and also a baffle in my sump came loose, so planning to fix that tomorrow.

Once everything is back on track i'll get some pics up if I can. These guys prefer to hide during the day, so while they are small enough to, dont think i'll see much of them. Be a different story when they are too big to squeeze into gaps!!

However, so do come into view during the day, and show in lovely pink/purple colours. Need to get a pic of that pattern for you guys!

Once tank is fixed, i'll be shutting halides off and switch to T5 lighting, maybe helping them come out a bit more, but if not, it will certainly help keeping the summer temps down.

PS: Mantle length now just over and inch!

Some a little bigger, some smaller, but aint seen no deaths yet, however, agression from one (suspect male) is getting worse - oh dear!! :lol:

sepia mestus (reaper cuttle) also has the two 'eye spots' and sepia pharonis has electric blue spots and lines on the mantle fin things too! - although with all the indicators it sounds like you might be right lol

Hey folks,

Today has been the first chance I've had to take some pics, and low and behold, my normally crepuscular (twighlight living) cuttles came out to see me. They're getting very friendly now :lol:

Excuse the glass, but thought I should get the shots now, rather than scare them away cleaning the glass!

They are of one of the larger babies I have. Bold as brass, even displaying his skin moulding powers in the later pics!

Close up
http://www.ultimatereef.net/uploads/DSCF0453%20(Medium).JPG

What you looking at:
http://www.ultimatereef.net/photopost/data/533/1374DSCF0454_Medium_.JPG

Look dad, I can walk (line below is silicone it thats close! and you can make out blue dots on skirt)
http://www.ultimatereef.net/photopost/data/533/1374DSCF0461_Medium_.JPG

Bet you cant fold your skin like me!
http://www.ultimatereef.net/photopost/data/533/1374DSCF0467_Medium_.JPG

Now i'm just showing off!
http://www.ultimatereef.net/photopost/data/533/1374DSCF0470_Medium_.JPG

Lets have a stare contest dad - bet I'll win!
http://www.ultimatereef.net/photopost/data/533/1374DSCF0474_Medium_.JPG

That's an incredible close-up!

Nancy

WOW! those are some great photos (especially the "what are you looking at" and papille shots!!!) definitely worth entering a few competitions with those two!!!

thanks for the update mikey! The offer is still open if you want some website help btw

i just noticed that the eyes are unusual - different to the regular w patter that is - does this help with the i.d as bandensis?

If the glass hadn't have been dirty I would have been really proud of those one! Not worry eh, still got the shots - and more will follow I'm sure!!

The eye thing doesn't help that much, however, there is a pic of a SB in mark normans book with the same patternation. I would say it is probablt a random shape rather than the "norm" but i'll keep an eye on that oscar and report back.

Thanks for the help on the website - however it's going fine - my only problem is finding the time to write it up!!

good -

good -

and good to hear! - lol

The photos really are spectacular and the glass is only slightly noticable in a few shots so not to worry! look forward to seeing this website also!

Had the opportuniy to feed a crab today, that got caught in with the shrimps.

Man, the go for them :lol:

videos mikey?

Hey Mikey!

Looking good. My new babies look exactly like yours!

Just seen Rich - right down to the baby colours!

Folks away for 2 weeks so made a bumber catch of shrikp last night, and got more crabs.

They are pro's at ctahcing and killing them. Even taking one that I thought was a little too big for them.

I'm off while my folks are, so expect more photos!

we're expecting :>

Took some shots today and last night just to get some progress pics and to show the colour range.

First one is a night shot with flash:

http://www.ultimatereef.net/uploads/DSCF0557 (Medium).JPG

Rest took today, as they are now starting to come out in daylight to beg for food!

Coralline colour:
http://www.ultimatereef.net/uploads/DSCF0574 (Medium).JPG

Normal day colours:
http://www.ultimatereef.net/uploads/DSCF0612 (Medium).JPG

Excited begging for food colour:
http://www.ultimatereef.net/uploads/DSCF0648 (Medium).JPG

Love these eyes:
http://www.ultimatereef.net/uploads/DSCF0665 (Medium).JPG

Just to add, these guys are approaching 2 inches in mantle length now!

wow cool mikey!

Well, had my first "major" ink tonight, when a little fella got startled and squirted about 3 times. The ink was a mix of smoke screen and globular. No reall effect on the tank at all, and it seem to just dissapear.

good skimmer?

An excellent skimmer - 4 times the tank volume!!!

The website is just about finished now too, but I need to put the finshing touches to it to make it look pretty!!

Will let oyu all knwo when it's done ;)

Looking good Mikey!

Cheers Rich! Praise indeed!

So far I havnt had any major inking sessions but I plan to move them to new tanks probably this weekend so that may change!

website is really coming on :)