if you dont know about it, its a tv show on discovery about the future evolution in animals, amonst those were the swampus ( large venomous octopus living in swamps 100million years in the future, sometimes goes onto land and can stay there for up to 4 days), squibbon (agile, super intelligent arboreal squid, swingin g through the trees 200 million years hence), and megasquid (giant clumsy dumb elephant sized squids 200myh)
do you think the cephalopods of today can one day take over land, replacing all the modern vertebrates? Can they really evolve to create the next civillization? Is the plot even possible?

do you think the cephalopods of today can one day take over land, replacing all the modern vertebrates? Can they really evolve to create the next civillization? Is the plot even possible?

I haven't seen the show, but I enjoy the plot so much that I don't want anyone to tell me if it is all a bunch of hooey! :wink: My neighborhood could use some :cthulhu: squibbons. :cthulhu:

Melissa

We talked about that for a while...the speculations are fun, but on the whole, very unrealistic. There was an interesting book called the "After Man" by Dougal Dixon on the same vein...makes about as much sense.
greg

the megasquid is SADLY virtually impossible. The weight would crush itself without bones, and the explanation they offered was crud.

wow, so much disagrees, the whole plot is ok though if you think today, if you capture a octopus on board a yacht, it'll crawl out of the container it is in and back into the ocean. Some octopuses can crawl onto the land, in "the future is wild" they showed, an octopus, i couldnt recognize the species, it was crawling onto the sand, and hunting young turtles, this suggests in millions of years this is possible, but i havent seen any squid be able to do the same, simply the shape of the body makes it hard, right? to move on land the body structure would have to change significantly, andthe tentacles have to be much stronger, to support its own body weight like seen on "TFiW" the animals look as if they have no trouble going about on land, there is a reason why there are no giant invertebrates today...they can not suppor tthe weight, if the squids that venture to land are like the size of larger arachnids, it'll make more sense. But in 100myh episode, they showed the special veins surrounding the creature's "lungs" help it breathe...is it really possible?
Other animals have made transitions from sea to land, but it takes time, they have to go through tiem periods where they need to continually go back into the water to replinish oxygen. Then again thats why there was the swampus, but they said the swampus was a descendent of octopus, and the terasquids, from squid, it'll obviously take more time for the squids to adapt on land then octopuses, so its mroe likely for the squibbon and megasquid to be descendents of octopus...the megasquid, the legs are so synchronizerd, it must be from loads of practice, if this animal trips and falls, wouldnt it die? and the slickribbon tht takes over tis body, doesnt anyone think the megasquid is gonna die, from being controlled?

It's [megasquid's] weight would crush itself. You said yourself "the size of an elaphant". Why do you think they have huge, THICK bones? (plus you never see a live one on it's side: its organs would collapse, even with it's huge bones)

It would be a mass of sprawled jelly if it were tht size and its mantle would have collapsed if it couldn't hold water in.

EXACTLY.

Oh and did squibbons evolve from PNTO's ?

OH, did you mean Pintos? The cars that go "boom"??? :lol:

whats PNTO?

PNTO is the Pacific Northwest Tree Octopus (http://zapatopi.net/treeoctopus.html)!

thats are real animal?? wow...but tfiw, says tht squibbon evolved from squids..

nope. its a hoax.

No , it is really true...I have seen them !
http://www.cardomain.com/memberpage/417152

Ha, ha, and also, ha. That guys crazy. :shock:

No , it is really true...I have seen them !
http://www.cardomain.com/memberpage/417152
what the...that site is about cars..not cephs... :lol:

the cephalopod connection only can be seen if you stare at the screen for five minutes without blinking, while muttering "fthagn r'lyeh".
No really.
g

nice sarcasm..

nice sarcasm..

It was, wasn't it, Mr. ReZal'EvaddGib? Bravo, Cthulhu!

and a big "shub niggurath" to all'ya'all... :D

Zark Zark Jumbo Clung Clung Jumbo.

It's [megasquid's] weight would crush itself. You said yourself "the size of an elaphant". Why do you think they have huge, THICK bones? (plus you never see a live one on it's side: its organs would collapse, even with it's huge bones)

In fact, elephants can and do occasionally lay on their sides without ill effects. This is one of those common misconceptions that have been printed in literature so often it’s become canon. Elephants have added structural support for their lungs due to a fibrous dense connective tissue which adds protection against pneumothorax. As far as their bones go, yes they are thick, but muscles also add enough support for an animal like this.

Legendary:

As far as the “Future is Wild” issue, having actually corresponded with Dougal Dixon and one of the other scientists who worked on the program, I can say that the explanation had to be watered down substantially to make it a little easier to understand. The “megasquid” was to be supported by means of the interaction between circular and columnar muscles and hydrostatic pressure. The Mega's movement is a little bit wonky for me to accept, and it does look like it would tip over like an SUV on crack. However, such a hydrostatic skeleton is possible, albeit unlikely. I mean, there would have to be one hell of a shift in selective pressures to create terrestrial invertebrate megafauna anyway.

My main issue with the megasquid is that it’s a squid. I mean, given the idea that at 100 million years from now a pulmonate (lunged) octopus has made the transition to land, you would think that maybe somewhere along the line to 200 million years such an octopus would make the transition to a more land-friendly form. If they had done a more complete cladogram or evolutionary path for the squibbons and megasquid, I would have found their explanations more likely. Some intermediate land squid forms might have helped. Then again, CGI is pricey, isn’t it?

As far as parasitic control over a host, look up the word "Rhizocephalan" in any invertebrate zoology text. That is the greatest example of parasite control over a host I can imagine. Oh, and molluscs are usually excellent intermediate hosts for parasites. You might say a "good" parasite usually doesn't kill its host.

Sushi and Parasites,

John

good bit of research there John ! :notworth:

Zharucth Lah!!!

John, your post is full of fascinating stuff! Special elephant lung equipment and crab domestication!



Sushi and Parasites,

John

But I want to keep my seafood separate from parasites! You will give me nightmares about the mussels in my fridge.

Melissa :P

John, your post is full of fascinating stuff! Special elephant lung equipment and crab domestication!

But I want to keep my seafood separate from parasites! You will give me nightmares about the mussels in my fridge.

MUSSELS!?!?!

... The most dangerous animal of all... :shock:

:jester: