[News]: Giant Squid Deaths Puzzle Scientists

[tonmo]

MSNBC posted the following article today about two recent giant squid deaths in Spain:

Giant squid deaths puzzle scientists (http://www.msnbc.com/news/967487.asp?0na=x2203CW0)

Thanks to TONMO.com member joelozito (http://www.tonmo.com/phpBB/profile.php?mode=viewprofile&u=1155) for the heads up!

[Steve O'Shea]

OK, really interesting; nice bit of skin on the mantle of the illustrated specimen, but there still appears to be a lot of skin abrasion that is consistent with having been through a trawl (and having been discarded).

Can anyone tell me if any new fishery (or established fishery) operating ~ 250-600 metres occurs off this coast, and what the local bathymetry is off this area?

We've now had five caught here over the past few months (winter-spawning population). If these are females (they have to be, the one ~ 40 feet in length) then they are FULLY mature (and likely spent). If these are true strandings (as in stranding post portem, natural mortality) then this female must be spent. Does anyone have any contact details/persons so that we can get to the bottom of the autopsy?

Money on it that the regularity in periodicity of capture is related to the breeding cycle of the animal in the general vicinity (rather than global warming ... I doubt this to be the case).
Cheers (great post)
O

[Fujisawas Sake]

Well, here's another one of CNN's trademark "let's tell 'em NOTHING articles":

Spain records squid deaths (http://www.cnn.com/2003/TECH/science/09/17/spain.squid.reut/index.html)

Food for thought. Sorry its been awhile since my last post. 8)

Sushi and Sake,

John

[/url]

[Bald Evil]

OMG! GLOBAL WARMING IS DEPLETING OUR GIANT SQUID POPULATION! This can only be another one of Blofeld's insidious schemes...

[Clem]

BE,

Blofeld may hate squid, but isn't Spectre's symbol an octopus?

The Asturias region of Spain has more cephalopods than Architeuthis to boast of. There's an ongoing experiment in aquaculture aimed at raising Octopus vulgaris in quantity. (http://www.growfish.com.au/Grow/Pages/News/2003/feb2003/54003.htm)

Clem

[Ogross]

Hi

Enn gives new story on the spanish squid issue:

Spanish navy shocks blamed for giant squid deaths
http://www.enn.com/news/2003-09-19/s_8591.asp

[edited by tonmo, full article can't be reproduced here, try link above :) ]

[joel_ang]

Well at least it ain't something thats going to stay for long. But I still ain't happie.....4 lives too many... :x

[Melissa]

Reminds me of the suspicion that US sonar caused whale deaths in the Carribean. Who's the real pirate there? Arrr! :x

Melissa

[Clem]

Ogross,

Thanks for posting that ENN/Reuters item. While I'm sure his heart is in the right place, I think Mr. Laria's categorical claim that sonar killed these Architeuthis is indefensible. Unless he personally examined the dead squid and determined which physical structures were compromised by the Hesperides sonar (something most every teuthologist would love to know about), blaming the ship's sonar smacks of agenda-driven opportunism.

It's odd that neither Reuters story has mentioned the two possible causes of death which Steve O'Shea suggested: that the squid were trawled in nets and discarded, or that they died after spawning. Perhaps Mr. Laria was uncomfortable laying blame on the local fisheries or discussing Archie's sex life, but I suspect that he's simply out of his depth.

:x

Clem

[Clem]

http://www.tonmo.com/phpBB/download.php?id=1748

One of the giant squid that was collected in the Asturian region of Spain made its way to the Musée de la Mer in Biarritz, in 2002. Click here (http://www.museedelamer.com/calmar/exposition.htm) to see photos of the squid in its acrylic sarcophagus, and navigate to other aspects of the presentation using the menu at the bottom of the page. Concours de dessin is a gallery of children's drawings of the squid.

These French-language cephalopod posters are too damn good looking. Will you look at the colors on that poster? It's beautiful. I want it.

:yelling:

Clem, screaming "WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN'--"

[joel_ang]

Ah so thats where calamari came from... I wonder, does it stink even after the squid is in the sarcophagus?

[Burstsovenergy24]

:? Huh?

BOE, Neil, Carol, and Steve

[Jean]

:yelling:

Clem, screaming "WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN'--"

Clem,

My Dad always used to say, usually when one of us Kids had been whining all day "I want doesn't get"!

Nevertheless I

"WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN' IT WAN'--" too!!!!

J

[Burstsovenergy24]

:lol:

[Clem]

Hmmm.

Just found a strange little film of the Biarritz Architeuthis. It's a black-and-white video of the squid lying in it's sarcophagus, with a sound track of ambient hospital noise. Dead simple and slightly creepy.

Biarritz Architeuthis In Hospital (http://www.onickz.com/videos/calmar.htm)

:goofysca:

[TPOTH]

Hmmm.

Just found a strange little film of the Biarritz Architeuthis. It's a black-and-white video of the squid lying in it's sarcophagus, with a sound track of ambient hospital noise. Dead simple and slightly creepy.

Biarritz Architeuthis In Hospital (http://www.onickz.com/videos/calmar.htm)

:goofysca:

http://membres.lycos.fr/britvtes/forum/images/smiles/wtf.gif
Roswell-like? what's the point? can't see a friggin' thing :x
Perfectly good footage ruined by "art"... *grumbles* *mumbles* :roll: :evil:

*shrugs* it's not like i don't have a giant squid next door :heee:

TPOTH

[Phil]

It looks like an outtake from Eraserhead. I liked the eerie sounds though; reminds me of my mother.

[Infusoria]

I've got a video camera and I (don't) know how to use it.

Utter crap.

[Jean]

I've got a video camera and I (don't) know how to use it.

Utter crap.

Oh Dear.............how's the Lit review coming Matt? :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

J

[Infusoria]

Oh Dear.............how's the Lit review coming Matt? :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

J[/quote]

Ask me a question about orange roughy, any question... Go on, you know you want to :P

I've got the 1st draft back and am now very, very humble. Apparently I can make 12,000 words become 6,000. I figure if I take out all the letter e's that should shorten it a bit.

vwls r rvrytd :P

[Infusoria]

I've got a video camera and I (don't) know how to use it.

Utter crap.

Oh Dear.............how's the Lit review coming Matt? :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

J

I was being sarcastic. I don't own a video camera. To explain: The guy that shot the video has a video camera and doesn't know how to use it , neither do I, but then I don't have a video camera so it doesn't really matter. Photoshop is my chosen medium for artistic expression - see my website.

[Infusoria]

Eek - possibly more stressed than letting on :oops:

[Clem]

Oh, so you do have a video camera, then? Can you use it?

[Infusoria]

Nope on both counts :P

[Infusoria]

Oh - most Orange Roughy questions can be answered with either:
There aren't any anymore or We don't know.

:P

[myopsida]

[qoute]Oh - most Orange Roughy questions can be answered with either:
There aren't any anymore or We don't know[/quote]

If we stuck to the original name of 'slimehead' there would be no market and therefore no questions

[Infusoria]

[qoute]Oh - most Orange Roughy questions can be answered with either:
There aren't any anymore or We don't know

If we stuck to the original name of 'slimehead' there would be no market and therefore no questions[/quote]

And no lit review

[Damien]

just an update, the link is ko : so if you want to see the biarritz museum's giant squid go to http://www.museedelamer.com/actu_2001_calmar_geant.php.

Unfortunately, I didn't go to biarritz recently ( after 2001), maybe i will go latter ...

[Steve O'Shea]

I would love for someone to translate this page .... it's been many many years (5 in fact) since this thread was posted on.

Thanks Damien

[DWhatley]

Steve, If you have a Google tool bar it offers a translator. I can make out the gist of it so the translator should mostly make sense.

This is what came out:


For the 1st time in France ... A Giant Squid (Giant Squid)

The monsters are for most of us, a mythical world, the exhibition "A giant squid in Biarritz" puts us in front of a reality ... their existence! The exhibition is produced by the Maritime Museum, in collaboration with CEPESMA and Isabel Guzman (biologist).

It allows:

- To see a true "giant squid" of the species Architeuthis duxThis young female of 2 years is 8 feet and weighs 104 kg. Stranded on the coast in Llanes Asturias September 20, 2001, she has probably lived in the pits "Tiberas tired" or "Carrandi '1,200 m deep.

- To learn through pictures explaining what little is known about this species, that is to say, it grew by nearly 1 cm per day, it is carnivorous and cannibalistic, that she is hunted by sperm whales, it lives at depths of over 400m, it has been found in several countries but in very small quantities and often in poor condition, etc. ...

- To achieve what is not known and remains mysterious to this rare species.

- See other species of large funds that are part of the Museum of the Sea

The Maritime Museum believes it is important that the public knows that these "sea monsters" that since the dawn of time rocking or haunt our minds, that these stories that we have done so much thrill, have a real basis.

Jules Verne "Twenty Thousand Leagues Under the Sea," Jules Michelet in "The Sea" by Victor Hugo and many others do not tell legends. These giants of the sea and are not from the imagination of their authors. The sailors in the taverns of related facts that eventually could be embellished.

It also requires that the public knows that we do not know any of the marine world and the Maritime Museum wishes to participate in improving the knowledge of the marine life.

Therefore, the Maritime Museum has invited many European scientists to participate in the autopsy that was done under the guidance of Dr. Angel Guerra del Consejo Superior de Investigaciones Científicas and Luis Laria of CEPESMA. Other collection examined and studied by scientists in their respective specialties and research will improve knowledge of this species.

On sale at the shop: The giant squid and its cousins: A very interesting book to learn all about giant deep sea and its cousins (32 pages - Color - Size 16.5 x 23 cm - Price: 2 € 50).

[Damien]

On the future I will try to translate all french articles i will post.
But google translation tool is usefull.

The squid exposed at Biarritz museum is one of the "numerous" giant squids found at the beginning of the millenium by spanish fishermen. At last 3 or 4 specimens if my memory is good.

The "golfe de cascogne" or Biscaye Golf is well know for sperm whales migration for reproduction ....this region seems to provide sperm whales food too ^_^. This region is closed to France and Spain and there are sometimes conflicts cases ( including piracy acts) between French and spanish fishermen.

Biscaye Golf :
surface : 225 000 scare kilometers
max depth : 4 735 meters. ...

[Damien]

in addition of previous posts, here are some informations about giant squid ( A Dux) studies in spain near the Biscaye Golf ( close to spain and France).

It gives some technical informations about depth ( my opinion is that they searched too deep, Kubodera filmed architeutis at 900 meters if my memory is good).

Here are some questions about the reasons of giant squids deaths at the beggining of the century.
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn6437-seismic-surveys-may-kill-giant-squid.html

Mr Kersauzon himself could have encountered a giant squid near Gibraltar. ( But this witness is debated)


Here is the article about the spanish expedition ( few years ago, They was no information about giant squids found in this expedition) :



"VIGO (AFP) - 21-08-2002 - A Spanish scientific expedition launched September 9 off the northeast coast of Spain is yet another attempt to find traces of Architeuthis, a giant flying squid in the depths abyssal and has never been filmed alive.

The waters of the Cantabrian Sea (Bay of Biscay) were chosen as field of research because they have already shipped several segments of dead giant squid, said Tuesday the project director, Fernando Gonzalez Sitges, at a conference press Vigo (north-east Spain).

One of the biggest pieces of squid giant identified to date, weighing 200 kg, was found a month ago aground on a beach in Australia in an area already explored without success, as funds off New Zealand, by teams of American, British, French or Australian.

Nobody has ever observed in the wild, between 300 and 1,500 meters deep, giant carnivorous mollusk, which scientists do not know life, varieties and social behavior or breeding.

Ignorance to the extent of the myth that has developed as the Kraken, a monster of legend who appears in the twelfth century in the stories of Norwegian fishermen who claimed he was able to enclose a ship from its huge tentacles and of the flow.

The Kraken has even inspired Jules Verne to the creature that attacked Captain Nemo in "20,000 Leagues Under the Sea".

More recently, the giant squid has been reduced to less phantasmagoric proportions, but still considers, evidence in support, it can attack ships, it merged with one of its prey, the sperm.

In a possible length of 30 meters, it has tentacles stretching up to 15 feet, a beak can shear a steel cable, but it has no ink, useless in the darkness of the abyss he searches for his big green eyes, the size of a human head.

The 25 men of "Project Kraken" - created by the production company of Transglobe Documentary Films and supported by the Spanish Ministry of Science and several museums of natural sciences - were given two weeks to explore an area 40 miles Water north of Gijon.

Unlike a recent expedition to New Zealand from the Smithsonian Institute in Washington, scientists will not use Spanish submarine, in order not to frighten the fierce giant.

After a reconnaissance mission in October 2001, the tactics used this time is to descend to 1,500 meters three cameras linked by fiber optics to their research vessel, which will run continuously.

At the center of the triangle thus defined, one ton of organic bait, but also electronic and lighting will be arranged, hoping to excite the curiosity or greed of the giant squid."

[DWhatley]

Damien,
Thanks for presenting some of the European interests in ceph search/research we don't have much opportunity to view information not originally published in English!

[Damien]

You're welcome ^_^.

I'm disapointed by the poor interest to giant squids from the part of French scientists.

Unifying spanish and french scientists could provide more efficiency to future studies.

Well, like I told you in my presentation, biological research in France was and is clearly decreasing and marine biology is one of the less viable activity on the the gouvernement point of view. But it could change in the next years ...

Most of the future doctors leaved France to England, Canada or US and will stay there. You have to understand that except to become a high school professor, most of biology students have few opportunities ( I knew some students ( master level ) on the Income Support (minimum benefit paid to those with no other means of support) because they were unable to leave France and didn't want to change job ...

Now with scientists away from France , the study level is decreasing now ..

But there are at least some french private or public insitutes with active scientists : IFREMER ( more axed on fishery analysis)
I suggest you to discover this site http://www.ifremer.fr/anglais/ ( wow it's in english !)

Michel Ségonzac seems to be one of the french ifremer members asked about the Kersauzon encounter :
http://wwz.ifremer.fr/memoire/l_oceanographie/michel_segonzac
http://wwz.ifremer.fr/memoire/layout/set/print/l_oceanographie/michel_segonzac/video

here is the translation :


Michel Segonzac, bestiologue deep

Michel Segonzac not pass unnoticed. He is a person, a physical. It is no coincidence that in 1998, during the thirty years from the center of Brest, his photo was chosen as emblematic of the researcher. Imagine: a bearded man wearing a ponytail, his eyes glued on the microscope. And when you have the chance to meet, what are its emphasis warm south-west and his gravelly voice necessary. It gives off a very lively and communicative dynamism, but so far the scientist is no less serious, calm and composed, especially when he speaks of his creatures, as he says.

Mr. Gouillou / Ifremer 2007

Michel Segonzac has materialized at the end of his career dream of many researchers in zoology: discovering an unknown animal. He even gained global fame through the specimen of a new species, named "Galathée Yéti", whose photo has toured the world in 2006.

Michel Segonzac was hired in 1974 to assemble and manage a laboratory, the National Center sort of biological oceanography (Centob), a partnership between the Museum of Natural History in Paris and the National Center for ocean exploration (Cnexo ). His job is taxonomy, that is to say the description and classification of animal species. An activity that alternates cruises and sorting work in the laboratory, both routine and challenging as new specimens are identified. All punctuated by continuous exchange with taxonomists around the world.

The discovery of the existence of hydrothermal vents in 1977 by Americans, then the identification of cold seeps in 2002 by geologists, have disrupted the work of biologists. These two environments are host to a very large animal communities, hitherto completely unknown.

Today, the mission of exploration and identification of marine biodiversity is no longer a priority. Refraining from entering into substantive discussions on research directions, Michel Segonzac would simply invite young people to rediscover the work of naturalist.

here is more information in an article :
http://www.liberation.fr/sciences/0101398260-l-apparition-du-calmar-geant


The emergence of giant squid

12/29/2001

Sylvie Briet


If the Earth is undergoing a period of mass extinction due to man, it never ends but not to reveal new species. For the ocean huge reserves remain unknown, beyond the microscopic species. Scientists come and discover a new kind of squid vast and strange, armed with very fine arm that extends up to 7 meters long.

Geologists of Ifremer (French Research Institute for Exploitation of the Sea), on a mission aboard the Nautilus, had observed first in 1988 in the North Atlantic and had reported to Michel Segonzac biologist in the same institute. The researcher was able to study through video tapes reported by the mission: "It undulates, moving in reverse, has a very small head and arms disproportionately. For now, it is called squid with long arms, waiting for something better, "says he. Moreover, the mysterious creature appears totally unmoved by the presence of the submarine.

Its morphology is very different from everything we know. Since the first observation, it was again found out and filmed by Americans and Spaniards in the Pacific and Indian oceans, eight times in total, still in deep water (between 2 000 and 4 700 meters).

No specimens, however, could not be captured because the squid with long arms have always been seen by geologists who were not equipped to "suck" kind of animal. This unknown species has not yet been scientifically described, but researchers know that it is widespread. All who have studied the videos have pooled their observations to publish an article in Science magazine (1). "This discovery gives us an idea of how little we know about life in the depths of the ocean," the researchers conclude. It will take a screenshot and a study in good and due form to classify the mysterious cephalopod.

(1) Science, 21 December.

this last article is not talking about architeutis of course but long arm squid : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigfin_squid.

the french "Nautile" batiscaph encoutered the first alive in 1988.

Michel Segonzac seems to be one of the french deep sea biologist but not studiying only squids..